ALL REPRO R.A.F. Irvin type jackets

[Speedster]

Just saw this...

Driving to Haderslev today - it's in Jutland - I went into a cafeteria on the way for a cup of coffe.
I was wearing my Aero Irvin, when an old gentleman sitting at the next table approached me.
"Isn't that a RAF Irvin jacket?"
I said yes, and he went on praising the quality and the shape it was still in.
When I told him, that it was new - he went on telling me, that he had owned one as a young man. A real one!!!
He got it - when he was 15 - from a RAF bombercrew, who bailed out over Jutland in 1943!!!
His father was in the resistance, and he had helped the airman to escape.
He had hid it at the attic till after the war. Not wanting to "upset the Germans".
He had used it a lot after the war, both when driving the tractor and his motorcycle. But it was all gone now.
He also told me, that it looked exactly like mine.
Brought back memories to him.

Fantastic story, Spitfire. Thanks for sharing.

 

[Spitfire]

Speedster:
Many thing can be said about Irvins from ALC - and many things has allready been said!
But your jacket looks like it has served you well for so many years.
I really like the patina.:eusa_clap
Some day - my friend. Some day you'll get that Aero or ELC. I just know!
Or even an original!!!

 

[Smithy]

Haven't seen you around for a bit Speedster so it's nice to see you back.

I remember when you first posted pics of your ALC and I thought then what a lovely jacket it was. As Soren says the patina of age that it has is great and the fleece seems to have squashed down to a nice level. These older ALCs to my mind are nicer then the newer ones. Someone here (was it James Pibworth?) posted pics of one from the 1970s that he picked up a year or two back which was a real stunner, miles superior IMHO to the modern ALC offering.

 

[KilroyCD]

The older ALC Irvins I've seen photos of do look nicer than their modern counterparts. The modern ALC Irvins have fleece that is far too thick. I bought one a couple years ago from Soren, and I felt like an overstuffed teddy bear while wearing it (plus I'm a bit overstuffed to begin with).
While wearing that jacket, just trying to get into and out of my car was like reliving birth! lol
I've since sold it and gotten a WPG Irvin.

 

[Speedster]

Thanks guys!

Yes, i'm sure that one day (sooner rather than later) a good repro or an original (later rather than sooner) will help keep me warm in the winter.

I too, look slightly like an overstuffed Teddybear in the jacket. I have a little more stuffing here and there since i bought it 20 years ago...

Smithy, not so much time at the moment to surf around here. Yes, i originally posted the pictures in the long closed (too much skin showing for the rules of the lounge? ) IRVIN thread.

 

[Stevie J]

I've since sold it and gotten a WPG Irvin.

And, are you happy with the WPG?

 

[KilroyCD]

And, are you happy with the WPG?

Yes, I'm quite happy with it. For the price ($350), it is an excellent value but it won't be as nice as the Aero Irvin.
I had a minor issue with the zipper early on (and I understand this is a common problem), but I was able to repair it and it has been fine ever since.
The thickness of the fleece is probably fairly close to that of the originals, and is much lighter than the ALC Irvins (hence the "overstuffed teddy bear" reference). The zips are not the highest quality, and that is a drawback. The seam tapes on some (but apparently not all) are synthetic. My Irvin has the synthetic tapes, but they very closely match the leather. Overall, the quality of the construction of the jacket is very good (zippers notwithstanding).
All in all, a very good jacket for the price.

 

[Spitfire]

Having owned one I can only say, that the WPG is a pretty accurate replica when it comes to design and cut - but the downside is, that you get the quality that you pay for. Obviously they have to cut some corners, in order to keep the fairly low price.
I was quite happy with mine - until I got my Aero. After that, there was no looking back.

 

[gyrobroyeur]

Hi, so here is mine:


It's an ALC too. I bought it used (but I'm still searshing worn traces...)
I wanted a jacket without side pocket like originals...
I wanted a winter jacket for riding my motorbike...
The warmer of the jacket was top for riding, but I quickly realise that riding with a no-pocket jacket wasn't easy, and not usefull!
So I ask to a taylor to do this (a B3 pocket in fact):

It's not a purist play, but I understand that ALC aren't for purists so I didn't vandalise a museum piece... Anyway, if RAF accorded a slow to AAF, the child could look like that...
This Irvin jacket isn't the one they actually sell on the Aviation leathercraft website, it's an older one:
There is no rivet on the leather piece stiched to the zipper. The holes in the belt are regularly spacing till the sewing (seems to be a lazzy factory production act).
There is no IRVIN inscription on the brass of the belt.



If somebody knows how old is myt jacket (approximatly) , i'm intereting by the information. Thanks

 

[KilroyCD]

Eastman cap to match the Irvin?

The other evening I was walking my dog, and the wind chill was near zero degrees (F). I was glad I was wearing my WPG Irvin, as I was toasty. Well, all of me except my ears. I was thinking that I need a cap with ear protection that would go nicely with the Irvin. Then I remembered about one I saw on Eastman's site that is a USAAF B-2 style, but in sheepskin to match the Irvin. I took the plunge and ordered one (I know it's not authentic, but tell that to my cold ears!). Has anyone else ordered one of these, and if so, how do you like it?
http://www.shopcreator.com/mall/eastmanleather/products/product-3090408.stm

 

[Edward]

The other evening I was walking my dog, and the wind chill was near zero degrees (F). I was glad I was wearing my WPG Irvin, as I was toasty. Well, all of me except my ears. I was thinking that I need a cap with ear protection that would go nicely with the Irvin. Then I remembered about one I saw on Eastman's site that is a USAAF B-2 style, but in sheepskin to match the Irvin. I took the plunge and ordered one (I know it's not authentic, but tell that to my cold ears!). Has anyone else ordered one of these, and if so, how do you like it?
http://www.shopcreator.com/mall/eastmanleather/products/product-3090408.stm

Not one of those, though I recently picked up one of the regular B2s from Eastman. Been toying with the idea of trying one for a while, couldn't quite make up my mind whether it would work for me or not (I tend to avoid baseball cap-style like the plague, as I think the long bill on them looks pretty dumb on me.... realistically or not, I've managed to convince myself it's something to do with the glasses..). When I saw a few 'slight seconds' advertised on the Eastman website at £25 - same price as the RAF ones (usually the B2s are £50 odds), I took the plunge. I've been very glad I did in this unusually cold snap we're currently having (coldest Winter in the UK for 15 years, apparently). Even with the ear flaps up, it keeps in significantly more heat than you might expect, certainly much more so than a thick woollen newsboy, or any of my fedoras (the latter being, in any case, impractical due to the brims hitting the high collar of the B3 I'm mostly wearing these days). I find I have to take the hat off to be able to pull down the ear flaps, but that's a minor inconvenience, really (probably puts less wear on the sheepskin than pulling at it in situ, too...?). They really do make all thed difference to a freezing pair of ears. All the heat advantage of a fur-lined flying helmet, without the 'fancy dress' look that wearing one of those with a sheepskin flying jacket would inevitably have. (Imagine the comments.... lol Already I get asked all the time whether I'm flying off somewhere, though "I like your Biggles jacket" was a new one at belfast airport last week (Yeah, he'd have worn a Barnstormer, though.... )). Given the option, I'd probably still want the bill about 1 1/2 - 2" shorter, but it doesn't especially bother me as it is. The sole disadvantage of thed bill is that (much like a fedora brim) it can cause the hat to be lifted off your head by a strong wind that gets up underneath it (I've already run down the street after mine once!), but really, that's not a significant enough hasle to worry about.

The one main warning I would give - though unfortunately it may be too late to help you here - is about SIZE. I originally ordered mine in a 7 1/8 - obviously, I figured, an accurate copy of a US issue garment would be sold by US size. When it arrived, however, it was clearly a size too small - just about wearable with the flaps in the 'up' position, but there was no way they were coming down. I phoned Eastman; not sure which of the gentlement on their staff I spoke to, but he was very helpful and looked up their sizing charts; they equated my need for a 57 with a 7 1/4. I was told there was one in stock and they put it aside with my name on it, asking me to refer to the phone conversation in an attached letter to the returned hat. I did and within a week had the sized up hat, which I have probably been wearing more than any other hat in my wardrobe for most of the last three weeks. I should expect that it would be prudent to order a size up on the RAF option also.

As I say, I'm talking here about the B2 version, but I can't see there being any difference with the Irvin version, other than the colour of the fleece. I'll certainly be ordering one of those too once I have an Irvin to go with.

Needless to say, I think the RAF option is a great idea, given how practical a hat I'm finding mine with the B3. Clever move on ELC's part, too: obviously, this way they can use up offcuts of fleece from Irvins that aren't big enough to go into one of the jackets, so much of the material going into each cap (only the horsehide bill aside, really) will be 'found' skin, effectively free and thus reducing the per unit cost (perhaps one reason why they can sell these much cheaper than the stock B2s).

 

[pipvh]

Does anyone happen to know if Eastman will do a late-period Irvin - ie the kind with many panels, recreating the originals which were pieced together from recycled jackets and trousers? I had an Aero jacket which I never quite took to: the arms were wrong, somehow, and I felt like the Michelin Man in it even when it was well worn-in, though originals never seem to fit like that. Is the Eastman fit better, in peoples' experience?

 

[John Lever]

They don't advertise them but they do make them, just ask. BTW the material has to be that for the BoB jacket.

 

[pipvh]

Yup, that's exactly what I'm after. Beautiful jacket - thanks for the pics. I live quite close to Eastman so perhaps I'll go over and talk to them. What would be great is if they could use some odd bits to recreate the original 'bitza' look...

 

[aswatland]

ELC have made quite a few late war multi-panelled Irvins in recent years and John's is a great example of their workmanship. BTW most late war Irvins were not made from re-cycled sheepskin. The patchwork of panels was to ensure every scrap of fleece was used efficiently.

 

[Hawk_Eye]

I've been planning on up-sizing my ELC Irvin in the next month or so, and I think I'll ask them if it will be possible to do a late war jacket. I understand from John Lever that while they arent advertised on the site, they are made occasionally. I wonder if they would be available in the skins used for the 1942 pattern, or just the new crinkled finish as seen on Johns jacket?

 

[John Lever]

I've been planning on up-sizing my ELC Irvin in the next month or so, and I think I'll ask them if it will be possible to do a late war jacket. I understand from John Lever that while they arent advertised on the site, they are made occasionally. I wonder if they would be available in the skins used for the 1942 pattern, or just the new crinkled finish as seen on Johns jacket?

Forget it !
Gary WILL NOT DO CUSTOM WORK .

 

[pipvh]

The 1942 jacket is a thing of beauty in itself, though. I'd probably go for one as is and feel lucky, if the fit was right for me.

You sometimes see late model Irvins (on ebay anyway) with stitching holes in the panels, as if the skins have been recycled. I wonder if those jackets are in fact genuine.

 

[aswatland]

The 1942 jacket is a thing of beauty in itself, though. I'd probably go for one as is and feel lucky, if the fit was right for me.

You sometimes see late model Irvins (on ebay anyway) with stitching holes in the panels, as if the skins have been recycled. I wonder if those jackets are in fact genuine.

You can't go wrong with a 42 pattern ELC Irvin, although the ones which were early production models are by far the best.

Late War Irvins with lines of stitch holes, especially on the windflap, indicate some use of recycled sheepskin and they are 100% genuine. I have handled over 50 late war Irvins over the years and although the panels are usually not recycled the wind flap was often made from a section of flying trousers or older jacket.

 

[pipvh]

I hope you'll have patience with a new member, but here's a question that's been on my mind: in light of the excellent photos on this and the other Irvin thread (the French YAK pilots come to mind), has anyone seen photos of RAF pilots wearing American jackets, or vice-versa? Did B-3s or B-6s find their way into RAF hands?