Aero half belt. Advice needed

[sweetfights]

That new Chevalier is the "Cat's Meow"!!!!

 

[Grayland]

Length is a huge issue for me, but I'm usually more concerned with the jacket being too long. I'm 5'9 and some change and I have to be really careful when buying jackets second hand. If the jacket has a dip in the front, I like to see a measuring tape picture of the back of the jacket with the jacket laid flat on the floor. This allows me to see the measurement of the lowest part of the jacket (the dip). I've even asked for measurements of the front of the jacket from top to bottom. I learned to ask for this measurement the hard way as I've bought two jackets (one new, one second-hand) that I sold quickly after the purchase.

IMO, I think many people worry too much about the back length. I've seen many jackets (posted here) with a satisfactory back length, but the dip in the front made the jacket fit too long and it didn't look right. I've never seen a jacket posted here that fit perfectly in the front that didn't also look great from the back.

 

[sweetfights]

Opinions on the thickness of the standard CXL Steer from Aero?? If i ask for the thickest what would be the estimated difference between the "standard" and "thicker" request?
My last cxl horse from Aero for my Sheene was very nice but i might like to go thicker with a half belt.

 

[sweetfights]

Also- I love the way Ton's half belt on his half belt's seem to sit a bit higher than average at the back. Is there a standard height for the actual half belt on the lower back to sit??

 

[jacketjunkie]

Aeros CLX Steer is 3.5 oz while the CLX HH is 3.0 oz, I believe. Ton's recent jackets and Nicks HWM are made from that 3.5 oz steerhide and look great, both in finish of the leather and thickness and I actually wouldn't recommend going any thicker than that even if it was available. Aero used to stock this absurdly heavy 4-4.5oz heavy Steerhide which my HWM is made from and the jacket is actually so heavy that I prefer to wear my 3.5 oz Vansons most of the time. Also, I am not sure that heavy stuff is CLX, finish and wear are very diffferent to my other CLX jackets.

 

[Bfd70]

I’m alao interested in a 1930’s. Not to hijack, but perhaps piggy back (sort of a pun) would someone be willing to comment on back design options. I’m completely naive when it comes to the differences in yoke, action, gusseted etc.

 

[jacketjunkie]

I’m alao interested in a 1930’s. Not to hijack, but perhaps piggy back (sort of a pun) would someone be willing to comment on back design options. I’m completely naive when it comes to the differences in yoke, action, gusseted etc.

I like a plain back best on a half-belt. My Teamster had some kind of action back which looked cool for casual wear but it popped out very oddly when I was working in it and I didn't feel any significantly improved range of motion. As for yoke, I don't like that two-pointed standard yoke on the 1930s HB, I would go with a single point yoke as on Ton's 1930s HB or none at all. All purely personal taste ofcourse.

 

[Bfd70]

So is the yoke primarily asthetic or does it serve a function?

 

[jacketjunkie]

So is the yoke primarily asthetic or does it serve a function?

No function that I could think of.. in fact it's an addition seam which is a potential weak spot and also those seams with thick leather folded under them make for longer break in because the jacket is super stiff around them.

 

[sweetfights]

I like a plain back best on a half-belt. My Teamster had some kind of action back which looked cool for casual wear but it popped out very oddly when I was working in it and I didn't feel any significantly improved range of motion. As for yoke, I don't like that two-pointed standard yoke on the 1930s HB, I would go with a single point yoke as on Ton's 1930s HB or none at all. All purely personal taste ofcourse.

I am convinced the shoulder gussets not only look great but might add a slight degree of greater arm movement. Hats off to Ton for some nice choices and inspiration.

 

[handymike]

I think gussets are cool, and might help get rid of some "bat-wing."
Carlos is right also that different maker's jackets sit in different ways as far as back length. I was shocked when my GW came in at 24", but it sits in the same spot as a 24.5" Thedi.
I was convinced I needed 25" when I ordered based on Aeros I'd owned.

 

[Carlos840]

I think gussets are cool, and might help get rid of some "bat-wing."
Carlos is right also that different maker's jackets sit in different ways as far as back length. I was shocked when my GW came in at 24", but it sits in the same spot as a 24.5" Thedi.
I was convinced I needed 25" when I ordered based on Aeros I'd owned.

If you think about it, there are really two back lengths, upper and lower! Or at least different ratios of shoulder/back length.
Trace a horizontal line from shoulder seam to shoulder seam, you can measure from the line up to the collar seam, or down to belt line.
Not all makers allow as much for the trapezius, meaning the jacket will sit higher or lower on you and change where the bottom hits your belt.

My Aeros for example have 3" from that shoulder center line to the collar, my Himel has about 1.5". So even though the Aero is overall longer, the Himel is actually longer from shoulder to belt. The Aero is taller from shoulders to neck.
I think that's why the Himel sits lower and hugs my shoulders better, also probably why it feels as long with a shorter back.

 

[sweetfights]

If you think about it, there are really two back lengths, upper and lower! Or at least different ratios of shoulder/back length.
Trace a horizontal line from shoulder seam to shoulder seam, you can measure from the line up to the collar seam, or down to belt line.
Not all makers allow as much for the trapezius, meaning the jacket will sit higher or lower on you and change where the bottom hits your belt.

My Aeros for example have 3" from that shoulder center line to the collar, my Himel has about 1.5". So even though the Aero is overall longer, the Himel is actually longer from shoulder to belt. The Aero is taller from shoulders to neck.
I think that's why The Himel sits lower and hugs my shoulders better, also probably why it feels as long with a shorter back.

well said and explained!

 

[ton312]

It's funny b/c my first BL had the HB placed lower. The 30's HB and recent BL did in fact move the belt up higher. I prefer the higher belt. It allows for a neater looking fit overall. Check it:
Cordo 2015:

Brown 2017:

Another thing, at least in my opinion, the yolk and gussets help shape the shoulders and upper back. Aero has improved the design of their gussets as well. I noticed right away when I received the brown BL. They function so much better than my 2012 j-106.

 

[handymike]

I like the higher belt too!

 

[ton312]

Forgot to mention, the higher HB creates more of a taper than flare at the hem. I like that a bit more as well.

 

[nick123]

Aeros CLX Steer is 3.5 oz while the CLX HH is 3.0 oz, I believe. Ton's recent jackets and Nicks HWM are made from that 3.5 oz steerhide and look great, both in finish of the leather and thickness and I actually wouldn't recommend going any thicker than that even if it was available. Aero used to stock this absurdly heavy 4-4.5oz heavy Steerhide which my HWM is made from and the jacket is actually so heavy that I prefer to wear my 3.5 oz Vansons most of the time. Also, I am not sure that heavy stuff is CLX, finish and wear are very diffferent to my other CLX jackets.

I’d actually go half an ounce higher and be okay with that too. This steerhide is really, really nice. Heavy, but not at all uneasy to wear. I had the same feeling with my Johnson 3oz overdye steer. Simply pliable for what be considered a very thick, heavy leather.

All of these points about the front dip of the 30s half belt are valid. I’d never given much thought to it (other than varifying back measurements), but yes, the front dip can make the jacket appear long. With Vicenza, it didn’t really matter, but I suppose a heavy hide being longer in front could impact wearing while sitting.

This probably won’t apply to a 30s model, but boy does the air go into the sleeve openings with the Highwayman. I now know why they put in storm cuffs by default. I think the storm cuffs are smart for a 50s model in most climates.

I’m all sold now. Only the Highwayman and some cheapos are left. :/ I LOVE steer.

 

[Carlos840]

It's funny b/c my first BL had the HB placed lower. The 30's HB and recent BL did in fact move the belt up higher. I prefer the higher belt. It allows for a neater looking fit overall. Check it:
Cordo 2015:
View attachment 113540
Brown 2017:
View attachment 113541
Another think, at least in my opinion, the yolk and gussets help shape the shoulders and upper back. Aero has improved the design of their gussets as well. I noticed right away when I received the brown BL. They function so much better than my 2012 j-106.

Back then (2013-2015), everybody obsessed about having a one piece back and the largest possible single panel. Add that to the fact that the half belt was lower and you really needed a huge piece of even leather per jacket.
Nowadays most Aero have a yoke, or at least most people don't view them as a bad sign anymore, and they have raised the half belts. Altogether, you don't really need that large a panel anymore. I'm sure that has some influence.
I remember that when the ELMC Californian came out, people complained about the belt being too high and wanting it to be more like your old Bootlegger. They also didn't like the multi piece back, it was seen as inferior.
Funny how things change!

I actually didn't really like yokes in the beginning, and really hesitated when i ordered my Bootleggers.
Seeing your pictures really makes me happy i went for a yoke, it really balances the back nicely. The cordo jacket is nice, but it looks very empty!

 

[ton312]

Back then (2013-2015), everybody obsessed about having a one piece back and the largest possible single panel. Add that to the fact that the half belt was lower and you really needed a huge piece of even leather per jacket.
Nowadays most Aero have a yoke, or at least most people don't view them as a bad sign anymore, and they have raised the half belts. Altogether, you don't really need that large a panel anymore. I'm sure that has some influence.
I remember that when the ELMC Californian came out, people complained about the belt being too high and wanting it to be more like your old Bootlegger. They also didn't like the multi piece back, it was seen as inferior.
Funny how things change!

I actually didn't really like yokes in the beginning, and really hesitated when i ordered my Bootleggers.
Seeing your pictures really makes me happy i went for a yoke, it really balances the back nicely. The cordo jacket is nice, but it looks very empty!

Totally agree. Heaviest hide imaginable and one solid back were THE thing when I started reading here. Times certainly have changed and I think for the better (visually anyway). I think Aero has quietly tweaked some design elements and it's made the jackets all the better. My 2012 j106 had useless gussets, no yoke and a massive back piece. That size 44" jacket was twice as restrictive than my 40" BL!
Also of note and as witnessed with your Himel, the higher armhole placement actually increases mobility, rather than decreases it. Arms can move independently of the jackets body. There's no drag on the body of the jacket when moving your arms. Bleeding edge armor effect if you will.

 

[sweetfights]

I advise 30s should sh between 24 and 24.5".

50s an inch longer

Thanks
I also have to figure in my long torso