Aero ebay frustrations

[schitzo]

I agree with you that sometimes (often?) things are not what they seem.However, there has been plenty of time for anyone to step forward and shed some light on the situation.

It sounds to me like you are totally unaffected by whatever happens unless you have a video-confirmation from all parties and you just continue to go on with you business as if nothing happened because...yes.....we dont have all the info. Here is a newsflash for you - we might never get all the info!

Look, I agree with you that one shouldnt speculate, but Aero coming out with Horween giving us this news, then taking back jackets to remake and send out new ones.....this isnt speculating any more...it is happening! This is quite enough for me to start thinking where I will happily and trustfully put my next $1000.
Bye yes, if someone would shed light on the situation, my feelings could very well turn, I am an open guy, but I expect the same thing back, if If I smell something shady I will act and feel accordingly until someone proves me wrong.




Botomline is that I have thought it through and it didnt take very long to feel uneasy. I started looking at my old jackets that have mismatched panels and sending photos to Holly. We are both different, apparently you arent affected emotionally - I am.



This sounds to me like if we take it down to specifics, you would happily buy a used Aero without even giving it a second of a doubt what hide it actually is made of? And you would also 100% trust people that seems like they did shady things in the past because you actually cant be sure?

You gotta have a limit dude, if we were to talk about sinking a million dollars into a restuarant that have had a bad reputation of pocketing investments and then the accused people just carried on their business I really dont think you would just carry on with the investment as if nothing happened becaue there is no proof. If you would, then I think you are the exception, if not, then we just have different limits to how much money we can spend without giving a f"#¤

Griff, my words are my words and they are carefully chosen. I don't think your guesses at what they might mean are helpful.

So, you have some information and it makes you feel how it does. Fine. You have explained your position well and I'm sure there are plenty here who share it.

All I'm saying is, I don't.


I guess this is the point where we should agree to respectfully disagree

 

[GriffDeLaGriff]

I want to make it clear that I think many of AL`s jacket look very nice, the tan one posted recently is one of the best jackets I´ve seen on FL and I have (before this) sent questions to Amanda about a jacket they had on their page that I was interested in.

Also as I said, I havent been 100% happy with some of my interaction with the new Aero crew. They havent really done nothing wrong, but as I said - Im not really comfortable with either....yet.


I also get your point about commenting on this. This is the second time I have commented on the issue and there are probably AL people, Aero people and customers of each "group" that are watching this and thinking all sorts of things. But really...wtf...I mean this is a forum where we are supposed to share our thoughts about jackets, quality of service and so on. I am a person that thinks openess is better then censorship, and if we werent to say what we thought, then what is the point of this entire section of the forum? Just go to the manufacturers portals instead.

I think its natural to not be fully comfortabel with what happned, and in my perfect world both AL and Aero should understand my position and not feel any bad towards me, but as you say, I probably am already on a bad side with them and their followers. If that is the case - so be it. You stand tall for what you do, good and bad, thats how I live my life, I understand completely if my customers feel uneasy if I am not 1000% clear with them.

 

[Grayland]

Very nicely said, Griff. Well done.

 

[schitzo]

Griff you've held up your end of this very well and I'm glad we're having this chat.

As you say, for me to talk to you on here about this is the purpose of the forum. Unfortunately sometimes the waters get muddied..

From my POV both companies can knock out excellent jackets. I'm just saying that I am very suspicious about a lot of the stuff I have read on these pages, and also of some of the people posting it. IMO, if you're the full shilling you'd have to be

Of course, Aero should do whatever they think is best for themselves - and if that includes posting on here from time to time then so be it. But personally, of the two approaches, I prefer the AL strategy, which is as far as I can tell to say nothing on here. Their version of events has never actually been explained and though that may lead some to point the finger (you did yourself earlier on in this thread) and say well, if you're not gonna explain or at least refute any of the allegations then you must have something to hide, I don't quite see it that way.

The trouble with this forum, in which jacket enthusiasts can chat with each other, is that it's been infiltrated. Transparent contributions from non impartial observers are the thing that irks me the most. And that applies irrespective of whether those contributions are accurate or otherwise, reliable or unreliable - I'm just not comfortable with that type of thing

 

[ButteMT61]

Well, opinions are the norm here. People got mad when they weren't warned about Aero USA. We are in fact here to help each other - not the vendors. I don't care if you or anyone else likes my opinions. I state them. You and others are free to refute. I get PM's galore. At last count in only 2.5 years, I'm nearing 400. Many are those thanking me for being honest. Thanks for help. I have no vested interest in ANY maker. I'm a consumer - period. Do I have favorites? Yep. Based on nothing more than service, product, and transactions. Sometimes posts come off as personal. Usually it's not the intent, but it happens. Makers are businesses. Posters here are generally just regular folks. As such, I post as one and offer what little knowlwdge I have. What I do have was learned from those hear with years of experience. As in my career, I got where I got having the stones to speak up. Some fear it. Some respect it. Some hate it. I don't care who falls into which category as I am what I am, to steal Popeye's line. There's people I don't reply to. I don't like their POV or politics or whatever. I sugges the same for those who dislike me. Or just engage and enjoy it.

 

[schitzo]

Well, opinions are the norm here. People got mad when they weren't warned about Aero USA. We are in fact here to help each other - not the vendors. I don't care if you or anyone else likes my opinions. I state them. You and others are free to refute. I get PM's galore. At last count in only 2.5 years, I'm nearing 400. Many are those thanking me for being honest. Thanks for help. I have no vested interest in ANY maker. I'm a consumer - period. Do I have favorites? Yep. Based on nothing more than service, product, and transactions. Sometimes posts come off as personal. Usually it's not the intent, but it happens. Makers are businesses. Posters here are generally just regular folks. As such, I post as one and offer what little knowlwdge I have. What I do have was learned from those hear with years of experience. As in my career, I got where I got having the stones to speak up. Some fear it. Some respect it. Some hate it. I don't care who falls into which category as I am what I am, to steal Popeye's line. There's people I don't reply to. I don't like their POV or politics or whatever. I sugges the same for those who dislike me. Or just engage and enjoy it.

Yep, I'll go along with all of that.

And I'll add also, that when you're on here asking for opinions if what you get back isn't what you were hoping for then don't be upset, or take it personally. Backside blow holes are everywhere! Qus sera obladi oblada

 

[ButteMT61]

Generally, if someone likes a jacket and I hate it I clam up. But if someone ASKS for opinions, I'll try to be nice about it. I've flipped no less than four jackets in the last year based on comments. Good comments. Nobody wants to sell a jacket they waited on and spent loads of cash on. But I know now that after the honeymoon is over, you'll be pissed if you don't listen. I've seen it 100 times in the last five years. I've done it a few myself. So now it's gotta be perfect on day-one. I literally get excited every time I don this Ventura. I have been so lucky that AlGore gave us global warming here because it's almost June and I'm still wearing it! This is just a perfect jacket.

 

[schitzo]

Generally, if someone likes a jacket and I hate it I clam up. But if someone ASKS for opinions, I'll try to be nice about it. I've flipped no less than four jackets in the last year based on comments. Good comments. Nobody wants to sell a jacket they waited on and spent loads of cash on. But I know now that after the honeymoon is over, you'll be pissed if you don't listen. I've seen it 100 times in the last five years. I've done it a few myself. So now it's gotta be perfect on day-one. I literally get excited every time I don this Ventura. I have been so lucky that AlGore gave us global warming here because it's almost June and I'm still wearing it! This is just a perfect jacket.

I don't think trying to be nice about it is the nice thing to do. IMO plain honesty is the best gift to receive. A while ago Hammerdown made me realise I had sleeves on a HB that were too long. I got them shortened and enjoyed wearing that thing for a year. Then earlier this year it was you who helped me realise I had a Herc that was also - ******nit - too long! So I had to flip it even though I really loved that leather and everything else about the jacket. That's the type of feedback I value and accordingly it's the type I try to provide.

 

[ButteMT61]

You can nicely tell someone there jacket is too big. Too small. Comprendé?

 

[schitzo]

You can nicely tell someone there jacket is too big. Too small. Comprendé?

capiched!

But that you wouldn't break the bad news in a nasty way, if all you were doing was trying to help, is kind of obvious too, no?

 

[ButteMT61]

capiched!But that you wouldn't break the bad news in a nasty way, if all you were doing was trying to help, is kind of obvious too, no?

Some folks don't like to hear it. My rule is if you come here, post, and ask, I tell. If you just show a jacket and don't want opinions, I generally pass. Not everyone cares or wants to know.

 

[Plumbline]

Thats the wonderfil thing about feedback .... it can be taken or disregarded at the recipients discretion

There are some more sensitive than others .... but if one always remembers that opinions ( as the saying goes) ... are like arseholes ... everyone has one !

 

[schitzo]

Some folks don't like to hear it. My rule is if you come here, post, and ask, I tell. If you just show a jacket and don't want opinions, I generally pass. Not everyone cares or wants to know.

Hmm.. but if you're posting pictures of a jacket - on a jacket forum - then whether or not you're asking for opinions, you basically are inviting them. In that situation you're gonna have to expect a few to come your way. And when they do if you aren't happy with them you can't very well then turn around and say 'none of your business'.

Of course you could do exactly that - and it has happened - my point being you can't do it and then expect others to not look at you sideways

 

[HoosierDaddy]

I want to make it clear that I think many of AL`s jacket look very nice, the tan one posted recently is one of the best jackets I´ve seen on FL and I have (before this) sent questions to Amanda about a jacket they had on their page that I was interested in.

Also as I said, I havent been 100% happy with some of my interaction with the new Aero crew. They havent really done nothing wrong, but as I said - Im not really comfortable with either....yet.


I also get your point about commenting on this. This is the second time I have commented on the issue and there are probably AL people, Aero people and customers of each "group" that are watching this and thinking all sorts of things. But really...wtf...I mean this is a forum where we are supposed to share our thoughts about jackets, quality of service and so on. I am a person that thinks openess is better then censorship, and if we werent to say what we thought, then what is the point of this entire section of the forum? Just go to the manufacturers portals instead.

I think its natural to not be fully comfortabel with what happned, and in my perfect world both AL and Aero should understand my position and not feel any bad towards me, but as you say, I probably am already on a bad side with them and their followers. If that is the case - so be it. You stand tall for what you do, good and bad, thats how I live my life, I understand completely if my customers feel uneasy if I am not 1000% clear with them.

Griff
You are being talked down to from a member who considers himself the lecturer. A teacher who attempts to set himself up as someone for all to measure up to. He will compliment that you are keeping up with him,somewhat,which is an insult within itself. Enticing you to explain yourself and back up to his superior point of view. That arrogance makes for meaningless argument. It contains an admitted ire that dominates practically every post. Some ignore that game. Some innocently fall for it..while others banter around only to see the next upcoming reaction.
HD

 

[schitzo]

Griff
You are being talked down to from a member who considers himself the lecturer. A teacher who attempts to set himself up as someone for all to measure up to. He will compliment that you are keeping up with him,somewhat,which is an insult within itself. Enticing you to explain yourself and back up to his superior point of view. That arrogance makes for meaningless argument. It contains an admitted ire that dominates practically every post. Some ignore that game. Some innocently fall for it..while others banter around only to see the next upcoming reaction.
HD

lol

wow! Yet more inspired insight from our resident commentator. How does he do it!? Sorry, am I stealing your role a bit there. But man, it's almost as though you have a direct portal into my mind and the power to steal my thoughts before they're even formed! Doubtless there must be many who are ever so grateful for this service you so generously provide HD, and glad for your ability to hold onto a grudge!

Hmm, but if you're done sniping for the day, might I suggest there is an afternoon nap out there with your name on it?

 

[tonypaj]

Lots of cultural differences showing up here. Nordics, Brits, Americans. I've lived amongst all of them, and to me the differences in the opinions can easily be explained by little nuances interpreted differently in different countries. I have no side in the AL/Aero stuff, sitting firmly on the fence. Many of the posts make sense...

 

[ButteMT61]

If you drink enough we're all alike lol
O rat least you don't care.

 

[GriffDeLaGriff]

Griff
You are being talked down to from a member who considers himself the lecturer. A teacher who attempts to set himself up as someone for all to measure up to. He will compliment that you are keeping up with him,somewhat,which is an insult within itself. Enticing you to explain yourself and back up to his superior point of view. That arrogance makes for meaningless argument. It contains an admitted ire that dominates practically every post. Some ignore that game. Some innocently fall for it..while others banter around only to see the next upcoming reaction.
HD

I am happy that it went on because then I get a chance to further explain my point of view, almost regardles of what other people say. Those who are watching either agrees or they dont, thats life in general.

 

[tonypaj]

Yeah, but you guys drink bourbon, the nordics vodka, and the brits beer. Your beer does not count as beer... The results differ. Not that I'm stereotyping here, no siree...

 

[ButteMT61]

Yeah, but you guys drink bourbon, the nordics vodka, and the brits beer. Your beer does not count as beer... The results differ. Not that I'm stereotyping here, no siree...

Wrongo pal. I'll drink anything lolWhen in Rome..