Aero & Eastman leather jacket collar problems

[Papa M]

My biggest area of contention, frustration and general dissatisfaction seems to lie with collars. Several of my jackets would be absolutely perfect if the collar either sat a little differently or was a slightly different or smaller shape.

I have a few Aeros that are perfect: Highwayman, another Highwayman with Mouton collar, A2 Aero Beacon, and a custom US Police copy.

However I have an Aero California with a collar frustration. I also have an Eastman A2 Pearl Harbor with the same problem. The collar tends to fold naturally at a point which makes the whole collar stick up too high and dig into my neck. If I turn it right down to the point where the collar is attached to the body then the collar looks slightly too big and deep. I'm currently working the leather in order to soften it in the hope that it will fall into a naturally more relaxed position.

I'm sure others will have experienced this problem.

 

[BellyTank]

I always found the collar shapes from both vendors to be lacking.
Something I have mentioned more than once before but it always seems to
be dismissed as nit-picking.

Nice jacket, shame about the collar...


B
T

 

[Papa M]

Nice jacket, shame about the collar...

Collar-wise - the most satisfactory of my Aeros happens to be a trainee-made Highwayman. It is probably the best fitting of my Aeros; and because it is a mid-weight hide it is also the most comfortable.

There's a sartorial lesson for all you FQHH devotees!

 

[P5640blouson]

collars are important

You are not alone when pointing at collar woes. Its a an important part of any garment and I believe that makers have always realized the complexity of the collar in achieving a perfect overall garment. Take for example, I have some driving jackets that specifically uses a ribbed/stretchable leather design in the collar area for maximum head positioning and neck mobility. Contrast that to my M-65 that has a zipper running the length of the collar. The M-65 field jacket is known to dig into the back of people's necks when folded down except for those that have upper backs and forward tilted necks like IGOR.

No doubt in my mind, a good collar is one that is either designed for comfort to begin with, or otherwise has the potential for being worn in / broken in to a custom suit the wearers unique neck shape and position. It must do these things while looking good-of course!

 

[CBI]

take a spray bottle with water and spray the front and back of the collar(s). Get it pretty wet, not soaked through but more than a mist. Water down the entire collar. Then shape the collar the way you want it and let the jacket hang in the closet until the collar is dry. If you do this 4 or 5 times, it should change the shape enough to fix the problem. I have done this with a number of my repro A-2's and it always has worked.

 

[jimmer_5]

It's interesting that you mention the collars on jackets. I was looking at buying a Vanson Enfield, but I couldn't get over the gimpy looking little collar. I just ordered my Highwayman, so I haven't experienced the Aero collar yet, but it looks like it's the right size and shape.

I really liked the spread collar on the Schott 689H that I ordered - too bad the sleeves were an inch too short...... had to send that one back.

 

[Papa M]

Water down the entire collar. Then shape the collar the way you want it and let the jacket hang in the closet until the collar is dry.

Thanks CBI - great tip and I'll give it a try. Is it imperative that it dries in the closet? I'm loathe to put something damp in close proximity to my other clothes. I'd have thought "out" of the closet in an airy space might be more logical?

 

[Papa M]

There's a sartorial lesson for all you FQHH devotees!

Actually I probably meant "satorial" as in revelatory, rather than "sartorial" apertaining to dress style.[huh]

 

[skippymchaggis]

Thanks CBI - great tip and I'll give it a try. Is it imperative that it dries in the closet? I'm loathe to put something damp in close proximity to my other clothes. I'd have thought "out" of the closet in an airy space might be more logical?

I don't think it has to dry in the closet. I think what CBI is saying is to use the water and then walk away and let it dry. You don't need to fiddle with it. You could probably even wear it dry, although that might be...unpleasant at times.

But it seems to me that actual use makes most leather products adapt to the user over time.

 

[CBI]

Sure, you can leave it anywhere to dry.

 

[P5640blouson]

Great suggestions for leather here...

Great suggestions for leather here...any ideas on how to deal with fabric jackets or one with a zipper sewn across the back of neck like in an M-65?
Hope I'm not hijacking the thread here.

 

[Nighthawk]

Just wondering, are we talking about fit of the jacket here or how the collar looks (i.e. does it look like those on vintage jackets)?

NH

 

[Papa M]

Just wondering, are we talking about fit of the jacket here or how the collar looks (i.e. does it look like those on vintage jackets)?

NH

I must admit that I'm not entirely sure. It is a combination of how it feels against by neck and throat, and my perception of how it looks in balance against the general configuration of the jacket.

I do keep looking at images of vintage jackets and they mostly look to be well balanced in collar size and shape. However when looking at images of modern repros they too look to be OK. Unfortunately it is not always the case when you receive the jacket in the flesh.

 

[Papa M]

take a spray bottle with water and spray the front and back of the collar(s). Get it pretty wet, not soaked through but more than a mist. Water down the entire collar. Then shape the collar the way you want it and let the jacket hang in the closet until the collar is dry. If you do this 4 or 5 times, it should change the shape enough to fix the problem. I have done this with a number of my repro A-2's and it always has worked.

I've now given this technique an initial trial - with my Eastman A2 and my Aero California. So far it is looking good. They are already sitting in a more satisfactory position and the tendancy to return to the original mal-adjusted positioning is already diminishing.

Thanks for the tip-off CBI.

 

[P5640blouson]

Weight of the jacket a big factor

I must say, if there is perfect ergonimics in the collar and shoulder, then the weight of the jacket will be evenly distributed, however if the collar section offers no support then the shoulders may feel more weighty. Also if the angle of the shoulders are off, then again a heavy jacket will have pressure points. I know this from wearing load bearing vests and body armor of sorts. Bottom line, the heavier the garment, the more you will have to work at it to get it comfortable. Exercising helps all this too, off course.

 

[johnnyjohnny]

collared and well-hung

one of the more interesting threads i've seen in awhile...

i suppose because i've often been dissatisfied with the collar on otherwise great jackets, and really hadn't focused in on fixing a collar and saving a jacket

i had purchased an older, meaning well worn, schott 135 made a few years ago in a manner not now offered, meaning with the single-piece back, which makes the jacket a near spittin image of the luftwaffe jackets i love so much (or french resistance fighter jackets for those who prefer)

the thing had, if you pardon the expression, NOT been well-hung...meaning it had been stored on a hanger with the collar rolling so the inside of the jacket next to the collar was on the outside...much worse than the one you see here, which is from schott's catalog and has only a hint of the problem:

at the time i started curling the outward roll the other way and put leather conditioner on the spot so it could be reformed...i a little conditioner only, and left it folded in the opposite direction for months...it helped eventually, and i would have kept it, but it was a little too small

so now i found the next size up, same jacket, virtually new, just a little collar roll as all of the new schotts of this type seem to have, and am happy to have found this thread as i see i erred in using conditioner, which probably just softened the leather so it could bounce back to it's misshapen form

now i'm curling the collar the other way and using the H20, which dries out the leather in the new shape, which seems to be giving excellent results in a much shorter time...the look i'm trying to get is less collar roll, like this:

i know this is a different model, but it's made with virtually no outward collar roll

nice to be able to correct these things and save an otherwise beautiful jacket, one that someone might otherwise have sold...

also, bending the collar back so it doesn't have the inside rolling out, has the neck sitting up higher, supporting more of the jacket weight, something mentioned above...things i hadn't even thought of until this thread

which must, ultimately, beg the question on how schott can make such a nice classic jacket with something as nerdy looking, and which lessens the comfort and lay of the jacket in the first place

my own answer is that, this is the sort of thing you don't find on the higher end jacket makers, the lewises, aeros...both of which i've had and which have flawless design, as well as execution

i have seen aeros worn with the collar rolling, probably a preference of the owner, but the highwaymen i got, and lewis of the same type style, both did not come with this affliction, as did the schott, from the outset

thanks again for the info, as i try it

 

[Papa M]

one of the more interesting threads i've seen in awhile...

Your contribution is fascinating johnnyjohnny.

It seems that we are trying to achieve opposite collar positions. You want yours to sit up like a collar on a shirt & tie. And I am trying to get mine to roll away - a little like the collar on an Aloha shirt.

I can understand the effect that you're after and on the face of it I would say that you are aiming for the most authentic shape. However I am personally unable to live with that leather, throat latch and zipper rubbing against my neck.

We both started our collar re-work sessions the same way: using conditioner. Now we have both started achieving our desires by using the water method recommended by CBI. What might have been a lot simpler is if we both met up and swapped all of our jackets!lol

 

[johnnyjohnny]

sWap

hmmm, what jacket size are you?

seriously, that's hilarious. or hilariously, that's serious. whatever.

but i'm sitting here with my new schott with it's collar rolled in so i can indeed have it look like a button down shirt collar, and you are with your aero californian doing the opposite

i've always hated those floppy shirts that have the collar's flapping wide open, whilst you have liked them. i exclusively wear button down collar shirts because they keep the collars from doing that.

to be overly honest to the point no one gives a cr@p, the reason i do so is i've always had a long neck, and growing up until weight training in high school i was a pencil neck...that inferiority complex (along with a buncho others) stuck to this day, and i'm always trying to get those jacket and shirt collars to not flap open on me, exposing so much neck

don't mean to turn this into a psychology reality show...but will keep you updated on the wet leather technique success as it can be used on many leather situations...which may, like here, relate back to psycho issues

;D

 

[Papa M]

.... the reason i do so is i've always had a long neck.....

.... and the reason I do the roll-away thing is because I have a sensitive neck - slightly prone to shaving rash.

Different strokes mate!

Now - back to some water treatment on my girlfriend's fetish-wear!

 

[johnnyjohnny]