1920s men's Art Deco shoes, 2 pairs

[Rudie]

Isshy, it's okay if you don't want to share your knowledge. But please don't tell me it can't be done. That's ridiculous. In all trades those in the know pass their knowledge on to those coming after them. If they weren't, we'd still have no wheels or electricity. I don't challenge your opinion that you have to handle lots of shoes to become an expert. But if you have enough knowledge to see the differences between a 1920s shoe and a 60s does 20s shoe just from a picture, then you would clearly be able to tell others how you came to that conclusion. Unless you choose not to.

I rather liked Dinerman's reaction to my post. He posted pics for reference. There was something to be learned, and that's a good thing. He is consistently sharing his knowledge, for example with a very good thread about dating vintage hats. I don't think spending tens of thousands of dollars to get your level of knowledge is an option for most of us. It sure isn't for me. It's great that you had the funds and the interest to do it. Now go ahead and tell others what you learned so they don't have to start from scratch again! You just seem to repeat your mantra that you have to buy hundreds of shoes until becoming an expert. And that's a pity, as people could learn a lot from you. You made a very good start at the beginning of this thread when you posted the reference pic of the rear seam. It would be nice to learn a few basics to know what to look for. I learned quite a lot about hats and suits from this board without handling hundreds of them, enough to learn the basics.

 

[Rudie]

Thanks, Baron. Exactly my point.

 

[Isshinryu101]

But you get the point, right? It's like someone asking me what tells me a jacket is from the 60s rather than the 40s, or from 1930s Germany rather than England, and replying:

lapels
buttons
lining
pockets
cut

- not very helpful. And if not being very helpful, what's the point of posting the reply? (not your reply, of course, but it's the one that's caused the minor ruckus)

Rudie's point is actually central to the thread as it has developed recently. Someone who doesn't know, but thought they'd stumbled on a pot of gold. At the beginning of any learning, you must take the word of the person telling you something. It helps to have very good vintage stores, say somewhere in the unpicked midwest of the USA, with knowledgeable staff to teach you. But most won't have that, or the money to blow on expensive mistakes.

Are we saying that they should stay in the dark? Why then have a discussion forum at all? Just for a show and tell without the tell, pictures but no discussion? If you're not using your knowledge for active teaching of newcomers, that knowledge is rendered pointless.

bk

p.s. I agree that there is no substitute to owning and handling acknowledged pieces from the era. But most people, for geographical or financial reasons, do not have that opportunity.

I posted a pic of a heel counter and gave a detailed description of the difference between the 1960's/ 70's and the original 1920's. THAT'S real info. However, it's ignored and complaining ensues because I don't write a 6 paragraph treatise about all the differences about the 2 eras' shoes? We live in a lazy world now. Do some research yourself and contribute something yourself. There will always be a give and take. Look back over the YEARS of pics and posts on the shoe threads. Look at the differences of the pics posted and the info given. Over 50% of what you need is already here!

Whan Marc C quit this thread, he said he was getting tired of doing all the research, sharing it, and getting nothing, but MORE QUESTIONS. Maybe a contribution or two without the complaints would help.

And yes, Ebay and MAIL makes ALL OF THESE shoes accessible in this century. I learned about English shoes by buying them, having them shipped to the US, then studying the, Same with JM Weston in France. French Ebay. Same with Dinkelacker. German Ebay. It's there, but only laziness is stopping some from learning.

Look at Flyfishark! The man has learned, then contributed a TON! My personal Vintage Shoe mentor is Cookie.. The man has to find ways to get Vintage shipped to AUSTRALIA to learn! He has done it, and now he knows a TON of great info. Same for Dinerman in Canada. Same for Sproilly in Finland (sorry if I'm off on the country).

 

[Isshinryu101]

Marc C. Lamented about this exact attitude before his recent hiatus from the site. Share something, ask SPECIFIC questions, then learn a bit at a time. Do not be so lazy. File away each and every piece of info you come across. There are little bits of info strewn about the various threads. Piece it together.

But, the maddening thing is the expectation that all the info will be written, published, then handed to you. Life is not that way. Give a little, get a little. Like that stupid checkout penny jar. If everyone TOOK pennies, and noone gave, there would be NONE!

Isshy, it's okay if you don't want to share your knowledge. But please don't tell me it can't be done. That's ridiculous. In all trades those in the know pass their knowledge on to those coming after them. If they weren't, we'd still have no wheels or electricity. I don't challenge your opinion that you have to handle lots of shoes to become an expert. But if you have enough knowledge to see the differences between a 1920s shoe and a 60s does 20s shoe just from a picture, then you would clearly be able to tell others how you came to that conclusion. Unless you choose not to.

I rather liked Dinerman's reaction to my post. He posted pics for reference. There was something to be learned, and that's a good thing. He is consistently sharing his knowledge, for example with a very good thread about dating vintage hats. I don't think spending tens of thousands of dollars to get your level of knowledge is an option for most of us. It sure isn't for me. It's great that you had the funds and the interest to do it. Now go ahead and tell others what you learned so they don't have to start from scratch again! You just seem to repeat your mantra that you have to buy hundreds of shoes until becoming an expert. And that's a pity, as people could learn a lot from you. You made a very good start at the beginning of this thread when you posted the reference pic of the rear seam. It would be nice to learn a few basics to know what to look for. I learned quite a lot about hats and suits from this board without handling hundreds of them, enough to learn the basics.

 

[Isshinryu101]

Back to the point of this thread. 1920's Florsheim Art Deco shoes. Are they or aren't they? THAT was the question.

 

[2jakes]

New to this very interesting thread. Hope it continues !

This is entirely different , but reading about the shoes & styles , has rekindled my interest in a pair I
saw on BoardWalk series (HBO). Italian made by Forzieri. Not sure if still available or price .

[/IMG]

 

[cookie]

New to this very interesting thread. Hope it continues !

This is entirely different , but reading about the shoes & styles , has rekindled my interest in a pair I
saw on BoardWalk series (HBO). Italian made by Forzieri. Not sure if still available or price .

[/IMG]

They are still on the Forzieri website.

 

[cookie]

Marc C. Lamented about this exact attitude before his recent hiatus from the site. Share something, ask SPECIFIC questions, then learn a bit at a time. Do not be so lazy. File away each and every piece of info you come across. There are little bits of info strewn about the various threads. Piece it together.

But, the maddening thing is the expectation that all the info will be written, published, then handed to you. Life is not that way. Give a little, get a little. Like that stupid checkout penny jar. If everyone TOOK pennies, and noone gave, there would be NONE!

Exactly he needs to learn his mother does not work here.

 

[VintageEveryday]

Hi, I'd be very interested to know if those shoes did sell if Marc's still around, as I have just aquired this pair of Florsheim shoes and am struggling to find comparisions as I think they're pretty rare.

I HAVE NEVER WANTED ANYTHING MORE IN MY LIFE THAN THESE SHOES!!!!!!

 

[Pinkcoke]

Really interesting to spot a pic of my shoes on pinterest tonight (uploaded by another member from here) and follow it back to this thread and read it all again 7 years later!
I can tell you I still have the shoes, partly because I like them a lot, and I've not seen anything like them since. I have since purchased some original 1920s mens shoes which are knackered, but allow me to see the differences.
Funny that looking back at the photos now, several hundreds of pairs of shoes later, I can tell just by the style and method of stamped markings inside that these are from the 1960s or later.
Admittedly I went into researching, buying, selling and handing women's shoes, not men's, but it still taught me a whole lot about dating footwear, manufacturing techniques, fashion trends, materials and makers/brands from around the world. I still hope to improve my knowledge on mens footwear.

 

[GHT]

Listen to Isshinryu101. The styling's dead on, but the detailing's all wrong for a '20s shoe.

Your knowledge on period detail is nothing short of amazing.

Looking at these shoes they do seem to shout 1920's. However, it's not the vintage that impresses me as much as the styling, so today I have bought not one, but two pairs of similar style, no need to date them, they are brand new.