Trousers patterns?

[Kishtu]

Hello gentlemen, I do hope you can help a lady in distress.

Okay not quite distress, a slight furrowing of the brow kinda thing.

Bit of background, my home sweetie is a tailor's grandson so has a finely honed eye for cut and fabric - also means that I've acquired a stash of vintage fabrics and patterns :whistling

I've just got some fabric from British Fabrics on eBay, a grey worsted with a fine gold stripe, 8m thereof. My plan is to make him a suit for Christmas (I'm a professional dressmaker, so it's not an enormously ambitious project) using one of the jacket patterns. 3 piece if fabric suffices!

My question is though, where the dickens am I going to find a good trouser pattern??

Thanking you in advance,

Kit

 

[Shaul-Ike Cohen]

I haven't seen patterns, but for pictures and the discussion of details let me use the cispondian advantage and be the first of about 300 people who'll point you to this thread about British trousers. There's one about German trousers, too.

 

[Kishtu]

Most kind, sir.

Looking at the splendid trews pictured therein I am wondering if I could dispense with a paper pattern altogether and tailor to fit on my willing victim. It crosses my mind that such would be perfectly in keeping with the way Jon's grandfather worked.

 

[Shaul-Ike Cohen]

Yes, but keep in mind that in case your successful, and natural pride leads you to bring photographical evidence to the forum, you'll be inundated by requests and won't be able to care about your day job anymore. Or food and sleep.

 

[Kishtu]

Food and sleep?

What are they?

For I have promises to keep, and three linen 17th century shirts to hand sew before I sleep!

 

[Alan Eardley]

Most kind, sir.

Looking at the splendid trews pictured therein I am wondering if I could dispense with a paper pattern altogether and tailor to fit on my willing victim. It crosses my mind that such would be perfectly in keeping with the way Jon's grandfather worked.

Kishtu,

I admire your enterprise, but I respectfully suggest that Jon's grandfather had produced a great many pairs of trousers before he could dispense with a paper pattern altogether Trousers are idiosynchratic - they have certain unique features which make them awkward to tailor if you have never done it before. I would suggest starting with a pattern to save yourself frustration. If you can't mock off a pair of vintage pants, can I suggest that you produce a pattern off a pair of modern ones and modify the stylling features to be more 'vintage', possibly using photographs to guide you as you make the necessary changes.

You could even use a pair of traditional trousers (the sort of Dunn's or Greenwood's 'old men's trousers' that appear often in charity shops) and cutting or picking them apart to use them as a pattern, rather than going to the trouble of making a paper pattern. I remember reproducing several pairs of vintage Levi's (one pair in leather!) by taking apart a pair of charity shop 501s in this way.

Good luck!

Alan

 

[Kishtu]

Good plan Alan. Thanks.

I was rather assuming that I'd acquired transferable skills tailoring women's trousers and men's, well, breeches for want of a better word, 17th & 18th c. style (waistband and front pleat looked similar!) but I take it that's ambitious?

 

[Alan Eardley]

Good plan Alan. Thanks.

I was rather assuming that I'd acquired transferable skills tailoring women's trousers and men's, well, breeches for want of a better word, 17th & 18th c. style (waistband and front pleat looked similar!) but I take it that's ambitious?

Ahh, sorry, I assumed (possibly because I was quite carried away by the lovely dress you are wearing in your avatar) that the your forte was garments of the unbreeched variety.

I think you can proceed with confidence.

Alan

 

[Kishtu]

Kind words, sir, but actually I think you're right to advise caution, because I did assume that it'd be a piece of cake and on reading your words discretion is the greater part of valour. Not about making the thing I hasten to add! But as you say there is no substitute for experience...

... the thought springs into my mind all unbidden and unwanted that I could do a trial run with some of that fabric stash. Now see what you made me do!
The poor man will be standing in his unmentionables all weekend having pins prodded into him lol

PS *blush* at the dress compliment.... la, sir - this old thing? I only put it on when I don't care how I look....

 

[BellyTank]

Might I suggest a pair of "waistband-less" trousers..?

You could almost use any straight legged trousers as a pattern, increase the rise and possibly the seat/hip volume. The trouser can be tailored-in suitably at the back seam and a rear cinch, or side adjuster arrangement added.
Front pleats if required but flat-fronted is a classic, although the pleats do allow for more secret hip/seat volume. Pleat-front is very smart and sleek, with no waistband.

I have had success with a very over-sized and voluminous pair of Swedish army trousers, which I "tailored" to a suitably smart yet roomy vintage fit, by contouring the back seam and side seams and making pleats in front- no waistband. If you begin with something large enough, (a roomy muslin prototype perhaps)which will allow for a wide enough leg, seat, hip, you can then whittle it down- fashion the top to fit above the buttocks and add pleats to the front. A high rise and plenty of volume are the place to start for a vintage styled trouser.

"Old Town" in Norfolk may offer some inspiration-

www.old-town.co.uk

scroll down to the "High Rise" trousers and click on the photos- a classic style which lends itself both to utility and dress trousers.

And this thread:
30s-50s British Suit Trouser photo resource
http://thefedoralounge.com/showthread.php?t=17254&highlight=british+trousers



B
T

 

[Alan Eardley]

Might I suggest a pair of "waistband-less" trousers..?

You could almost use any straight legged trousers as a pattern, increase the rise and possibly the seat/hip volume. The trouser can be tailored-in suitably at the back seam and a rear cinch, or side adjuster arrangement added.
Front pleats if required but flat-fronted is a classic, although the pleats do allow for more secret hip/seat volume. Pleat-front is very smart and sleek, with no waistband.

I have had success with a very over-sized and voluminous pair of Swedish army trousers, which I "tailored" to a suitably smart yet roomy vintage fit, by contouring the back seam and side seams and making pleats in front- no waistband. If you begin with something large enough, (a roomy muslin prototype perhaps)which will allow for a wide enough leg, seat, hip, you can then whittle it down- fashion the top to fit above the buttocks and add pleats to the front. A high rise and plenty of volume are the place to start for a vintage styled trouser.

"Old Town" in Norfolk may offer some inspiration-

www.old-town.co.uk

scroll down to the "High Rise" trousers and click on the photos- a classic style which lends itself both to utility and dress trousers.

And this thread:
30s-50s British Suit Trouser photo resource
http://thefedoralounge.com/showthread.php?t=17254&highlight=british+trousers



B
T

BT my man,

You take the words right out of my mouth (or, more accurately, straight from my keyboard). I guess you found, as I did, that the hardest part of doing a high waist without a waistband is getting the area in the small of the back (the seat riser) to lay flat. I used trial and error and an inside-out fitting by a patient wife. Any tips for on your part?

Alan

 

[BellyTank]

Trial and error- shaping it a little at a time.
It can be undone and redone- no problem.

But with a flat front, contouring of the side seems, to get a fitting seat, small of back and waist seems necessary. This is not so easy on a pre-made pair of trou- hip and rear pockets and all. Rear pockets want to meet in the middle, of course, the more you adjust the back seam and if the hip pockets are "on seam", almost impossible at the side.

This is why a prototype is useful in getting the contour and volume of the 4 trouser panels correct- then all your seams (and pockets)can be put in the right places.

Inside-out-fitting is a very useful way to pull the surplus cloth out in the right shape and place over the rear and up toward the waist.

Altering anything that is pre-made (the easy way)is difficult- side seams tend to wander- trouser back panels are wider than fronts, side seams tend to skew...

B
T

 

[Kishtu]

Murky buckets, gentlemen. (That's how you spell the French for thanks, isn't it? )

The prototype went unnervingly well, although some final tweaks to be ironed out. His T M Lewin suit trousers have two back darts (waistband to pocket) and we'd worked on a similar principle - having looked at some of the photos in the British trousers thread, I prefer shaping the back seam: much cleaner line. No rear pockets, though. *shudder* Nasty things!

The prototype is a nice grey gabardine - photos to be posted once pieces are tacked rather than pinned. But am deeply, deeply impressed with the style indicated by the gentlemen here.

Oh - a tip from the tailor - there shouldn't be a pattern for bespoke trousers. They should be tailored on the individual.

 

[BellyTank]

Drats!!!

Drats!
Darts is what I forgot to mention.

Let's see...

Our Resourvoir for now.

(that's French for auf wedersehn, isn't it..?)

B
T

 

[Shaul-Ike Cohen]

(that's French for auf wedersehn, isn't it..?)

Mercy, Tank!

(That's French and German for "thank you"…)

 

[BellyTank]

ありがとう


That's Japanese for Thanks.

B
T
W

 

[BellyTank]

Or as Oz used to say on "auf wiedersehn, Pet" in his best German accent,
Donkey shite.

B
T

 

[Shaul-Ike Cohen]

Mercy, Tank!

(That's French and German for "thank you"…)

I forgot to add: It's also English for "[Please have] mercy, [Belly]Tank!"

 

[BellyTank]

Danke? that's German for Tak.

B
T