The BORSALINO BROTHERHOOD

[HarpPlayerGene]

Are my credentials in order?...

Here's my brown Allesandria

And my dark blue Trionfo

 

[PhilS]

Italian Sizes

I know I've seen this answered before but I can never find it when I need it -- what are the equivalencies for these Italian sizes and American sizes? That is, what what 4 1/2, 5, 5 1/2 on the older Italian hats correspond to in inches and/or our current sizing system? Even more to the point, given I only care about me, what is MY Italian size if I am a 23"-7 3/8?

And what is the technical term for the Italian sizes?

Forgive my lack of memory on this point, which may even be answered earlier in this thread.

 

[jimmy the lid]

I know I've seen this answered before but I can never find it when I need it -- what are the equivalencies for these Italian sizes and American sizes? That is, what what 4 1/2, 5, 5 1/2 on the older Italian hats correspond to in inches and/or our current sizing system? Even more to the point, given I only care about me, what is MY Italian size if I am a 23"-7 3/8?

Here's some interesting background on the Punti Hat Sizing Sytem.

And here's a Conversion Chart.

Cheers,
JtL

 

[shortbow]

ID a Borsalino?

Greetings Gents. This is my first post. My Sunday-go-to meeting hat is a very fine OR type Borsalino, bought by my father in El Paso in the 'fifties. It is still mint, a very light weight felt, the finest quality felt I've personally seen in more than 30 years of wearing hats, mostly Open Roads and such.

My question is how do you grade a Borsalino? Besides this one, I have another vintage Bors coming I just scored on ebay and would like to know more about them.

Thanks

 

[YETI]

I'd gladly join...

.

It is said that America is (or at least was) a nation of joiners. Yup. Witness the Open Road Guild; the Stratoliner Society; and the aptly named Brotherhood of the Thin Ribbon.


Time to add to the mix. We hereby grant a charter to the BORSALINO BROTHERHOOD.


I've got three Borsalino homburgs that don't suit me, and I'm selling them soon ... so they don't count. But THIS is different:

---------------------------------- http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.d...MEWN:IT&viewitem=&item=270050553065&rd=1&rd=1

The hat on the left is a 1930s Borsalino, made for the U.S. market. It just arrived today. I'm busy reblocking and stretching it a bit, so photos will have to wait. In any case, this Borsalino is a keeper and I choose it to induct me into the hallowed BORSALINO BROTHERHOOD.



Join us, paisano!



.

but I sold all mine

 

[Magus]

One of My Borsalino's. This one hails from the early 40's.

Sign me up.

 

[PhilS]

Belated Thank You Jimmy

Here's some interesting background on the Punti Hat Sizing Sytem.

And here's a Conversion Chart.

Cheers,
JtL

Only just saw this reply. Thanks!

 

[Woodfluter]

Originally Posted by PhilS:
I know I've seen this answered before but I can never find it when I need it -- what are the equivalencies for these Italian sizes and American sizes? That is, what what 4 1/2, 5, 5 1/2 on the older Italian hats correspond to in inches and/or our current sizing system? Even more to the point, given I only care about me, what is MY Italian size if I am a 23"-7 3/8?

Here's some interesting background on the Punti Hat Sizing Sytem.

And here's a Conversion Chart.

Cheers,
JtL

I struggled with this before. The first reference (and two others I've found) says the Punti size is the circumference in inches divided by pi + 1, or 4.145 (using the "Hatter's pi" rather than the exact version).

Let's say your head diameter is a whopping 24 inches. Then, 24/4.145 = 5.79, which is somewhere in the netherland between a 5-1/2 and a 6 Punti.

Now the referenced chart (and others like that I've seen) say a 24 inch circumference would be a size 7 Punti. Ooops. See the problem?

On the other end of the scale of inaccuracy, a 22 inch circumference head (US size 7 or 56 cm) should theoretically be 22/4.145 = 5.3 Punti. Rounded off, 5-1/2 Punti. The chart indicates that it is 4-1/2 Punti.

Nowhere on the web has anyone addressed this discrepancy. I suppose it's best to just ignore the theory and go with the chart, whatever on earth it's basis.

- Bill

 

[AlanC]

^Clearly you're thinking about this way too much. lol

 

[J.T.Marcus]

Originally Posted by PhilS:
I know I've seen this answered before but I can never find it when I need it -- what are the equivalencies for these Italian sizes and American sizes? That is, what what 4 1/2, 5, 5 1/2 on the older Italian hats correspond to in inches and/or our current sizing system? Even more to the point, given I only care about me, what is MY Italian size if I am a 23"-7 3/8?



I struggled with this before. The first reference (and two others I've found) says the Punti size is the circumference in inches divided by pi + 1, or 4.145 (using the "Hatter's pi" rather than the exact version).

Let's say your head diameter is a whopping 24 inches. Then, 24/4.145 = 5.79, which is somewhere in the netherland between a 5-1/2 and a 6 Punti.

Now the referenced chart (and others like that I've seen) say a 24 inch circumference would be a size 7 Punti. Ooops. See the problem?

On the other end of the scale of inaccuracy, a 22 inch circumference head (US size 7 or 56 cm) should theoretically be 22/4.145 = 5.3 Punti. Rounded off, 5-1/2 Punti. The chart indicates that it is 4-1/2 Punti.

Nowhere on the web has anyone addressed this discrepancy. I suppose it's best to just ignore the theory and go with the chart, whatever on earth it's basis.

- Bill

Woodfluter, Are you a Georgia Tech alumnus, perchance?

 

[Lefty]

My ticket to ride

The old:

 

[Lefty]

The new:

The old is the softest, most floppy hat I've held. It's like a 43 year old (by BK's dating method), sad looking teddy bear - not the most beautiful of possessions, but well-loved.

The new is the hat I wear most often because it's the most replaceable hat I own - even though the old was under $3 at an estate sale.

 

[bolthead]

Great Lids Fellas....

Here's mine.....

Pocket.....

Light Gray........

Dark Gray.........

Flat Cap........

 

[HarpPlayerGene]

MY CREDENTIALS, AGAIN...

I've been fiddling with my Photobucket links so here's my Borso's again, plus a new old one. (Also visit the links for more shots of the first two.)

Brown Alessandria -
http://s261.photobucket.com/albums/ii79/harpplayergene/Borsalino Brown/
Kind of a transitional style I believe since it so easily works as Homburg or snapped down brim.

Blue Trionfo -
http://s261.photobucket.com/albums/ii79/harpplayergene/Borsalino Blue/

Green Alessandria -

 

[jimmy the lid]

You've been posting some great lids lately, Gene! These are some nice Borso's -- but, MAN, I am LOVIN' that green lid! :eusa_clap :eusa_clap :eusa_clap

Cheers,
JtL

 

[cookie]

Petrol Green Borso



This should be arriving soon from Bella Italia!:eusa_clap - but the blue Trionfo is un trionfo

 

[HungaryTom]

Gene, Coookie,

Great hats!

Congratulations.

Wear them for Cent anni!!!!


Tom

 

[HarpPlayerGene]

You've been posting some great lids lately, Gene! These are some nice Borso's -- but, MAN, I am LOVIN' that green lid! :eusa_clap :eusa_clap :eusa_clap

Cheers,
JtL

Thanks gents. I've got it in mind to wear the green one with a yellowish silk shirt at my caricature gig tomorrow night.

I took a little break from acquisitions recently and spent some time photographing and uploading so I can 'show-and-tell' with you folks more often! Still a few to go...

 

[Lefty]

My $22 antique mall find

 

[Lefty]

Maybe they transposed the numbering system between 65 and 67 and my "new" one is a 67. Checking into the wonderful cav edge thread, there were still 5 years to go before the process came to an end, so I think that 67 is probably right.

As my old flickr photos are gone, here are the borso from my older post that I can't edit.
The New

The Old (a 65 beater from BK's dating system)