Real McCoys fell off?

[Canuck Panda]

Real Mccoy fell off? Yes and No. Everything everyone says about them is true, but there are also more to the story.

Here are all the RMC leather jackets I've had, not including military, so only Buco brand and Joe Mccoy brand, and why I do or do not have them anymore. In numeric order,

J-24
I\ /I shape
Current production version. I traded my size 42 jacket for a size 44 jacket. Size 42 felt small for me but the size 44 feels too boxy. I also have the LW J-24 in size 46, and it fits very similar to this RMC jacket in size 44, but in totally different leather. The minute I find an older fit that fits like my J-82 I will get rid of this current fit 44 jacket and all my other J-24 styling jackets.

J-25
I\ /I shape
I bought this used. It is a total keeper for me. This was around 2017s production give or take a year either way. Old fit size 44.

J-57
)Y( shape
This is a New Zealand made jacket. But there are Japan made ones. As soon as I find one with the white Japan label this one would be replaced. I actually prefer the Japanese Shinki over the NZ horsehide because it has harder topcoat, the NZ top coat fades too fast compared to the Japanese Shinki version.

J-82
Y shape
This is the steerhide version before the padded horsehide version. This is a total keeper for me. Once I find a J-24 in this cut / silhouette that's end game J-24 for me. Not all jackets from mid 2010s were bad. This one was exceptionally good imo. Most people would have to go up one or two sizes on this jacket though. This one is size 44.

J-100
)Y( shape
Old model I think, I am confused, but I bought it used and it has white pocket bags.
Feels a lot like the J-57.
I don't have this jacket anymore, and I am looking for the Shinki J-57.

Joe Mccoy Freeman
I) (I shape
This one is a keeper for me. I bought this jacket from Japan. The one small detail RMC missed was the inside flip up and down collar, but it was either this or wait for John, I remember he had an original RW for pattern study.

Joe Mccoy Mobster
\ / shape
I had a size 40, sold it and got another size 42. This is the model most people go after, but I don't get it. Every heritage motorcycle brand in the US can do this jacket just the same or better in some cases.

Joe Mccoy Nelson
) ( shape
So basically this is a Highwayman with half belt fit. Rainbow Country does a better job at this than RMC imo. I wear the RC one and sold the RMC one.

Joe Mccoy Steinbeck
I I shape
This is RMC's 1930s fit half belt. I sold it because I did not warm up to the reverse T paneling back aka the center seam. I am ok with the T panels on coats and trucker and military jackets but for some weird reason I didn't warm up to it for the half belt look.

So we are looking at a 50/50 chance in my RMC experience. RMC military line hits harder and has much higher satisfaction rates for me. I also don't have an issue with RMC's pigment wax shinki. I actually have the same leather in my Johnson jackets as well. It is harder wearing than most assumes it to be. Not as nice as RC horsehide imo. RC makes their horsehides looks like how Badalassi looks, grainy and shiny, but the thicker ones are stiff as hell, only the thinner ones are soft so there is always a trade off.

RMC gets a passing grade from me but only at their Japanese price points.

 

[cbez]

Sir please delete this propaganda, all Japanese jackets are tubular, long rectangles.

 

[Aloysius]

Sir please delete this propaganda, all Japanese jackets are tubular, long rectangles.

While this isn't the case, I think the thing to remember about the rectangle and A shaped cuts is that they're not a case of bad patterning so much as a deliberate design.

It's not like the designers of those brands don't know how to pattern a normal jacket–after all in most cases they have vintage ones they're studying–but that cut with the tight shoulders and slim straight (2010s) or flared body (2020s) is intentional, as it's a fashion trend in Japan. I don't like the cut of the "YSL moto" jackets either but their weird shape isn't because YSL can't afford patterners; it's because that's the desired look.

Much like in other subcultures both in Japan and the West the desired look has been a throwback to 90s and late 80s designs in the other direction with the massively oversized shoulder. (We tried to explain to Zangy that this was in fact trendy but he didn't believe us.)

 

[ton312]

Vs

LOL.

 

[Rm759]

Anyone have one of these "garbage" RMC J100's old cut in size 44 I'll take take it off your hands. DM me.

 

[thenillplaydirty]

In my opinion.
The Real McCoy's Japan went bankrupt in 2001, and Real McCoy's International, which took over the management, is just one of the derived brands (Freewheelers, Rainbow Country, Toys McCoy,etc).
For now, I think Real McCoy's is too expensive. It used to be much harder to get. It's easier to get now that the price has gone up and fewer people are buying it.
I am japanese, and I don't know why foreigners rate Real McCoy's so highly.
I think Aero Leather and Vanson are better.

 

[Jonanah]

Here on TFL we talk about RMC jackets like they're something really special. But in Japan they really aren't. Every big city has a RMC store which carries dozens and dozens of j24s j100s A2s or what have you. It's like walking into a Schott store in the US.

I’m not following how a product’s availability in the country where it’s produced is an argument against its quality—particularly at the scale of “dozens and dozens”

 

[Marc mndt]

I’m not following how a product’s availability in the country where it’s produced is an argument against its quality—particularly at the scale of “dozens and dozens”

Where did I say anything about quality in the part that you quoted?

 

[Jonanah]

Where did I say anything about quality in the part that you quoted?

Oh apologies I thought that’s what this whole thread was about

 

[Cheech]

As @Edward mentioned, if you stick around long enough, you’ll see the rise and fall of various jacket makers in the views of this community. It’s happened to Aero, John Chapman, Himel, and Field, to name a few. And that’s not to say that the reasons for backlash haven’t been legitimate. Part of it seems human nature, too, what with the desire for novelty.

I haven’t owned as many RMC/JMC as @Canuck Panda, but I’ve had quite a few, and I’m also of the mind that they are worth the cost to me but only selectively so and on the secondary market. I’ll also note that some of their jackets—the old J-22, J-82, 30’s aviator—offer a more flattering fit for me than others, like the J-100. I would probably think otherwise if I had @ton312‘s superhero proportions. That said, I think their patterns and product are quite good. Not $2k+ good, but good nonetheless.

 

[WolfofStateSt]

Real Mccoy fell off? Yes and No. Everything everyone says about them is true, but there are also more to the story.

Here are all the RMC leather jackets I've had, not including military, so only Buco brand and Joe Mccoy brand, and why I do or do not have them anymore. In numeric order,

J-24
I\ /I shape
Current production version. I traded my size 42 jacket for a size 44 jacket. Size 42 felt small for me but the size 44 feels too boxy. I also have the LW J-24 in size 46, and it fits very similar to this RMC jacket in size 44, but in totally different leather. The minute I find an older fit that fits like my J-82 I will get rid of this current fit 44 jacket and all my other J-24 styling jackets.
View attachment 665710

J-25
I\ /I shape
I bought this used. It is a total keeper for me. This was around 2017s production give or take a year either way. Old fit size 44.
View attachment 665711

J-57
)Y( shape
This is a New Zealand made jacket. But there are Japan made ones. As soon as I find one with the white Japan label this one would be replaced. I actually prefer the Japanese Shinki over the NZ horsehide because it has harder topcoat, the NZ top coat fades too fast compared to the Japanese Shinki version.
View attachment 665712

J-82
Y shape
This is the steerhide version before the padded horsehide version. This is a total keeper for me. Once I find a J-24 in this cut / silhouette that's end game J-24 for me. Not all jackets from mid 2010s were bad. This one was exceptionally good imo. Most people would have to go up one or two sizes on this jacket though. This one is size 44.
View attachment 665713

J-100
)Y( shape
Old model I think, I am confused, but I bought it used and it has white pocket bags.
Feels a lot like the J-57.
I don't have this jacket anymore, and I am looking for the Shinki J-57.
View attachment 665714

Joe Mccoy Freeman
I) (I shape
This one is a keeper for me. I bought this jacket from Japan. The one small detail RMC missed was the inside flip up and down collar, but it was either this or wait for John, I remember he had an original RW for pattern study.
View attachment 665715

Joe Mccoy Mobster
\ / shape
I had a size 40, sold it and got another size 42. This is the model most people go after, but I don't get it. Every heritage motorcycle brand in the US can do this jacket just the same or better in some cases.
View attachment 665716

Joe Mccoy Nelson
) ( shape
So basically this is a Highwayman with half belt fit. Rainbow Country does a better job at this than RMC imo. I wear the RC one and sold the RMC one.
View attachment 665723

Joe Mccoy Steinbeck
I I shape
This is RMC's 1930s fit half belt. I sold it because I did not warm up to the reverse T paneling back aka the center seam. I am ok with the T panels on coats and trucker and military jackets but for some weird reason I didn't warm up to it for the half belt look.
View attachment 665724

So we are looking at a 50/50 chance in my RMC experience. RMC military line hits harder and has much higher satisfaction rates for me. I also don't have an issue with RMC's pigment wax shinki. I actually have the same leather in my Johnson jackets as well. It is harder wearing than most assumes it to be. Not as nice as RC horsehide imo. RC makes their horsehides looks like how Badalassi looks, grainy and shiny, but the thicker ones are stiff as hell, only the thinner ones are soft so there is always a trade off.

RMC gets a passing grade from me but only at their Japanese price points.

Yeah I have B3 and A2 respectively, and sometimes I wonder if I should have gone the Eastman route instead. The leather on my RMC is beautiful but the zippers are flimsy. Makes me wonder which brand I should go to for future military-inspired jackets. I ended up getting my N3B and Peacoat, original vintage military surplus, secondhand. I'm looking for a deck jacket soon, though, and I'm not sure where to start.

 

[WolfofStateSt]

While this isn't the case, I think the thing to remember about the rectangle and A shaped cuts is that they're not a case of bad patterning so much as a deliberate design.

It's not like the designers of those brands don't know how to pattern a normal jacket–after all in most cases they have vintage ones they're studying–but that cut with the tight shoulders and slim straight (2010s) or flared body (2020s) is intentional, as it's a fashion trend in Japan. I don't like the cut of the "YSL moto" jackets either but their weird shape isn't because YSL can't afford patterners; it's because that's the desired look.

Much like in other subcultures both in Japan and the West the desired look has been a throwback to 90s and late 80s designs in the other direction with the massively oversized shoulder. (We tried to explain to Zangy that this was in fact trendy but he didn't believe us.)

View attachment 665751

Yeah I need to find a brand for people with my body type.

 

[Canuck Panda]

Yeah I have B3 and A2 respectively, and sometimes I wonder if I should have gone the Eastman route instead. The leather on my RMC is beautiful but the zippers are flimsy. Makes me wonder which brand I should go to for future military-inspired jackets. I ended up getting my N3B and Peacoat, original vintage military surplus, secondhand. I'm looking for a deck jacket soon, though, and I'm not sure where to start.

I don’t have Eastman B3 but I do have their fictional contract A2, and I also have had both RMC fictional contract A2s. They used the same Talon zipper! Personally I thought they could both have used Conmars but I am biased against Talons pulls so that’s not fair. I also don’t understand how Eastman can be one price one day and doubled in the very short time, at least RMC was always expensive, even 30 years ago when they were still made in New Zealand. I do not have Aeros A2 jacket but I had many of their civilian jackets, and I’m not seeing how can Eastman get away with the prices over Aero, they both have the same tiny forward collars too for patterns. Anyways, if you don’t like RMC for whatever assumed reason, then go with Goodwear, he is the best in the military repros imo, but it may also be years before you get a custom jacket from him, I keep tabs on his sale page.

 

[WolfofStateSt]

So, is it a problem with talon zippers in general? I broke the zipper on my RMC A2, and I was like, damn, if only they put a YKK zipper on this thing. I gave away my Schott flight jacket to a friend, and that was a tank with a YKK zipper. I like everything about the RMC except the zipper, but I guess it would be silly to expect a repro brand not to use a repro zipper.

I wonder if Goodwear will make me an accurate A2 except for the zipper and just put the beefiest zip on that jacket.

 

[Bfd70]

I highly doubt it. JC is known for his accurate repros.

Iron heart makes the best deck jacket imho.
not historically accurate

 

[Aloysius]

So, is it a problem with talon zippers in general? I broke the zipper on my RMC A2, and I was like, damn, if only they put a YKK zipper on this thing. I gave away my Schott flight jacket to a friend, and that was a tank with a YKK zipper. I like everything about the RMC except the zipper, but I guess it would be silly to expect a repro brand not to use a repro zipper.

I wonder if Goodwear will make me an accurate A2 except for the zipper and just put the beefiest zip on that jacket.

It's really not about #5 vs #8, #10 and other bigger sizes. It's about a specific repro Talon that has this issue, but is used by a lot of vendors due to the look. My vintage #5 Talons don't have this issue at all. And the new ones have mostly been okay though I wouldn't get them by choice. The one in my Field jacket was busted from day one though I sort of forced it back into place. (Note: Greg offered to replace it; I just couldn't be bothered sending it back.)

With A-2 leather, going over #5 is really not necessary at all even though it's the norm today. A vintage #5 or a modern Ideal Conmar or YKK Universal #5 will give you the vintage slider look and top performance.

 

[WolfofStateSt]

I highly doubt it. JC is known for his accurate repros.

Iron heart makes the best deck jacket imho.
not historically accurate

I was thinking of Iron Heart or Heat Straps for the Deck jacket. It doesn't have to be historically accurate; just keep the spirit of the original.