MERCURY - WHEN WAS IT LAST USED?

[deadlyhandsome]

Here is a pic of the hat, this appears to be a tall crown. It almost like vintage right?.

View attachment 344056 View attachment 344055

No, it’s not a tall crown at all. It’s truly nothing at all like Cagney’s hat. Not only is the crown much lower, the Selentino crown has a lot of taper that instantly disqualifies it as a hat of the vintage you’re looking at. Realize that in hats small measurements make a huge difference in the look of a hat. A 1/4 inch of brim or crown is huge.

I recognize the setting in your screenshot. I’ve bought a few hats from that eBay seller. I like the Selco hats I’ve seen better than any of the Selentinos.

 

[Apollo]

Wow. What’s the different between the selco hats compare to the other selentinos hats.

 

[deadlyhandsome]

Wow. What’s the different between the selco hats compare to the other selentinos hats.

The couple of Selco hats I bought were denser and more like vintage felt, still not the equivalent of vintage, but closer than the Selentino. The Seco hats I had/have were beaver or beaver blend whereas the Selentino Sterlings are rabbit. My Selcos were also block more classically and were easy to reshape.

 

[jlee562]

Not sure what all this has to do with mercury use?

But I just looked at that Cagney hat, looks like a tall crown #52 with a short brim, 2", maybe 2 1/8". Maybe a full 6" crown? It's pretty big. Much bigger than anything you will find off the rack these days. Looks like my Optimo Dillinger. There are some 60's stingies that resemble these but will be a tad shorter.

 

[deadlyhandsome]

Hi, if you read through the thread in sequential order, you will get your answer.

By the way, people go off topic on threads all of the time. I don’t know what makes me any different…

Jared @jlee562 is right. A post or two off topic isn’t an issue, but we should take this elsewhere. If you want to continue we can use PMs or continue it here:
https://www.thefedoralounge.com/threads/czech-republicans-tonak-huckel-no-name.36821/page-17

 

[Apollo]

Jared @jlee562 is right. A post or two off topic isn’t an issue, but we should take this elsewhere. If you want to continue we can use PMs or continue it here:
https://www.thefedoralounge.com/threads/czech-republicans-tonak-huckel-no-name.36821/page-17

Alright, cool.

 

[jlee562]

Jared @jlee562 is right. A post or two off topic isn’t an issue, but we should take this elsewhere. If you want to continue we can use PMs or continue it here:
https://www.thefedoralounge.com/threads/czech-republicans-tonak-huckel-no-name.36821/page-17

In retrospect, I hope that didn't come off as too snippy, Brent.

 

[deadlyhandsome]

In retrospect, I hope that didn't come off as too snippy, Brent.

Not at all, Jared. I knew we were going too far off course and I should have made the change on my own. Sometimes we all need a little reminder.

 

[Gary in NC]

This is a fascinating topic to me (hat rookie in training) so I'm reviving the thread with this question: I've read an article that says much of the poisoning came from inhaling fumes released into the air while steam was applied during the hat making process. It seems to imply that the mercury-treated felt wasn't so dangerous until steam hit it. So - does that mean some of the mercury toxins in a pre-40's hat could have survived all those decades just minding their own business until somebody (like me) unwittingly steams them out into the air?

 

[Frunobulax]

This is a fascinating topic to me (hat rookie in training) so I'm reviving the thread with this question: I've read an article that says much of the poisoning came from inhaling fumes released into the air while steam was applied during the hat making process. It seems to imply that the mercury-treated felt wasn't so dangerous until steam hit it. So - does that mean some of the mercury toxins in a pre-40's hat could have survived all those decades just minding their own business until somebody (like me) unwittingly steams them out into the air?

The steam was from the liquid which contained the mercury compound. The volatilization of the compound was inhaled and entered the bloodstream through the lungs. This is a very efficient poisoning route.

Mercury and other heavy metals do their damage through a cumulative effect, as it lodges in the body (brain) and isn't sloughed off. There is likely a very minimal amount of mercury in a vintage hat made with this carroting process. You certainly aren't going to see any effects from normal wear.

Perhaps if you burnt a couple thousand old hats and breathed the fumes, you could make a dent, but if you find that many hats that old, please call me first.

 

[mayserwegener]

This is a fascinating topic to me (hat rookie in training) so I'm reviving the thread with this question: I've read an article that says much of the poisoning came from inhaling fumes released into the air while steam was applied during the hat making process. It seems to imply that the mercury-treated felt wasn't so dangerous until steam hit it. So - does that mean some of the mercury toxins in a pre-40's hat could have survived all those decades just minding their own business until somebody (like me) unwittingly steams them out into the air?

The problem was during the treatment of the skins. That is why some large hat companies moved fur cutting / preparation away from their hat factories. Tonak** is the only factory left that works from skin to felt (also complete hat) in same factory.

Gustav Menschel who was the Technical Director at Ebreichsdorfer (Austria) Filzhutfabrik - S. J. Fraenkel Wien wrote to me that nitrate of mercury treated fur was available up to the mid 1960s. He didn't provide source info.

I have snips from a film produced in 1941 by Janyška (Czechoslovakia) that shows skin preparation (and manual felt production).

I have a good deal information on this general topic on my website and offline documents.

** Mentioned earlier in this thread that Tonak used nitrate of mercury. From what I can remember JHS (became Tonak after WWII) moved away from nitrate of mercury prior to WWII. There was much push back (look to move away from nitrate of mercury) starting in the late 1800s.

 

[DonBowl]

To hopefully revive this thread:
I recently came across an old Stetson Bowler hat, presumably from before 1920 and I have been a little concerned about the potential use of mercuric nitrate on the felt when it was made.
I'm not 100% sure if there could still be any traces of the compound in the felt after so many years and if it can still be dangerous if I ever put it on or even touch it with bare hands. After all there are things we can't see going in a microscopic level.

 

[belfastboy]

To hopefully revive this thread:
I recently came across an old Stetson Bowler hat, presumably from before 1920 and I have been a little concerned about the potential use of mercuric nitrate on the felt when it was made.
I'm not 100% sure if there could still be any traces of the compound in the felt after so many years and if it can still be dangerous if I ever put it on or even touch it with bare hands. After all there are things we can't see going in a microscopic level.

Did you read the entire thread? It seems Fruno a few posts above answered your question adequately.

 

[DonBowl]

Did you read the entire thread? It seems Fruno a few posts above answered your question adequately.

Certainly, I read it. Nevertheless, it's just a little uncertainty that has me questioning the possibilities.
Thank you though.