Magnoli suit gone wrong - update

[daddy-o]

Some of you may remember the thread about my magnoli custom hollywood suit that went a bit wrong. The thread is now closed so here is the latest for those who want to know. Indy was very friendly and forthcoming and offered to remake the suit. I retook the measurements ( which I am sure were more or less ok in the first place) took some pics, selected a new fabric and send back the old suit ) wasnt too happy about the extra postage but indy wanted the suit back). Now the new suit arrived and yes it is much better but no it aint the perfect late 40´s , early 50´s style suit. The jacket fits well but lapels are too narrow and point up to shoulder. I dropped the belt at back as there was too much chance it would go wrong again. Pity though, these were the period features that would give the jacket the desired look. The pants are also better than the drainpipes I had first but still are too narrow and tight around the crotch and upper thigh. judge from the pics yourselves. When I sit down the fabric just digs into my thighs and becomes uncomfortable. The pants should have been roomier up top. I wrote to Indy and asked if I take the pants to a tailor and he lets out as much as possible on the side seam if that would help. Maybe it will, there is about 1-2 cm on the side that could be taken out.Not sure if that would mess up soemthing else though. Overall the suit looks ok and vintage enough, pity though that it aint perfect.
Will I ever get that perfect fitting and looking suit ?????

the tighter pants

the whole suit

the lapels definately different from the website pic

and last one from the back

 

[Tomasso]

send back the old suit, wasnt too happy about the extra postage but indy wanted the suit back.

Then he should have assumed the cost.

 

[dhermann1]

I still have yet to deal with my similar situation. I've just been so busy. Mine came out way too big. [huh] But I know Indy will do his best to make it right. Sigh.
BTW, if that was a plaid suit, I'd be saying "Check that checked Czech! Daddy-O!" Unfortunately it doesn't work with stripes.

 

[reetpleat]

I mean no offense to magnoli. I don't know him and have never seen his work. He has always seemed like a good guy, so I am glad to hear he is willing to work with you.

But my question is a general one about custom work. HOw hard can it be. You are a fairly normal physique. How hard can it be to take a vintage pair of pants, and rip them apart to get a good custom pattern and do duplicates of them. I don't even think that should be necessery, but if that is what it takes, why not do it?

I just don't really get why these custom guys have trouble giving us what we want.

I am guessing the problem is generally with a tailor not beliving us when we say what we want, or not being willing to change. I would think Indy would not have this problem.

Does he do the tailoring, or does he have tailors in Australia or Asia maybe do it. I ma guessing it is the latter ,in which case he might be having the same problem as we have with tailors. We tell them what we want and they give us what they want.

Hope this can get worked out for you and Indy can continue to build his business by giving the people what they want.

 

[dhermann1]

I totally botched the measurements, but I'm not a tailor, and the instructions leave a lot to be desired, so I don't feel like I should take the blame for that. I suggested to Indy that video clips and photos would be a better idea, and he seemed to agree. I've been told the thing to do is get a professional tailor to do the measurements, and tip him $20 or $30.
The work is done in Thailand. Indy is very frank about this.

 

[herringbonekid]

i'm not in the least surprised that mail order suits turn out ill-fitting. it's hard enough getting a tailor to do what you want when you meet him in REAL LIFE. that is what fittings are for... to make adjustments before the suit is finished. ordering a suit from someone in another country based on measurements and expecting it to be a perfect fit is to me frankly, lunacy.

 

[vintage68]

I learned my lesson a while ago: Never take the measurements yourself, never have a friend take them (even though well meaning), always go to a tailor and let a professional do it. If you have a relationship with the tailor they will usually do it for free, otherwise a nominal fee is sometimes charged like $20 bucks. WELL worth the time and aggravation.

 

[reetpleat]

i'm not in the least surprised that mail order suits turn out ill-fitting. it's hard enough getting a tailor to do what you want when you meet him in REAL LIFE. that is what fittings are for... to make adjustments before the suit is finished. ordering a suit from someone in another country based on measurements and expecting it to be a perfect fit is to me frankly, lunacy.

True, but while I tend to be an average size, I am surprised at how well many suits I find fit me. I would expect a custom tailored suit to at least have the right style and fit as well as a vintage suit does.

 

[herringbonekid]

I would expect a custom tailored suit to at least have the right style and fit as well as a vintage suit does.

i'm surprised reetpleat, that you can't see the difference between a suit made in say, 1941 by a tailor or even by a factory that has made hundreds of thousands of suits of that type for customers who they are keen to please...... and a mail order suit made in Thailand by someone who has no idea how high the waist on a 1940s suit trouser should be, and who couldn't really care less either.

 

[dhermann1]

I'm SURE he cares, he just doesn't know.

 

[herringbonekid]

i'm sure Magnoli does care, i'm talking about mail order suit makers in general.

 

[skbellis]

Magnoli's Tailors

If I am not mistaken his Tailor's are in Thailand. I bought a suit from him the beginning of last year fory wedding in March and it turned out quite well. But I remember being surprised by the bundle that arrived at my door from Thailand. Before I opened it I kept thinking..."I don't remember buying anything from Asia."

Cheers,

---Scott

 

[Indy Magnoli]

I'm still working with Daddy-O on these, so it's not over yet.

As for internet tailoring, the fit is only as good as the measurements provided. I do my best to go through and make sure there are no glaring inconsistencies, but that really only catches major mistakes. Having a tailor measure you can save a lot of hardache indeed.

It's tough when you're offering both 1940s baggy pants right next to 1960s slim trousers to guys who are both thin and not. An accurate u-crotch measurement for one will be way to snug on another. The same for the finished thigh circumference.

Sometimes there is a bit of trial-and-error with ordering on-line, but most of my customers get just what they are after on the first go.

Kind regards,
Indy

 

[daddy-o]

well I take aboard all your opinions. Yes a local tailor is the best option. After three attempts here I gave up. There was always something wrong, despite numerous visits. Indy seemed the best choice available and he was trying to fix what went wrong. He just send me an email and offered to fix the pants issue. Ok, more cost, postage- but at least he is trying to get it right. I aint criticising
Indy as it will always be difficult to make a suit without having your measurements taken by the guy who will actually manufacture the darn suit. Incidentally the pants are high waisted, not extremely but that pic does not really show it. I just came to the conclusion that nowadays there aint nobody who can make a great looking and great fitting suit like in the 40´s. Sad but I think true.

 

[Indy Magnoli]

I think that this shot shows the height of the trousers fairly well:

If you tied your tie shorter with the point barely touching the waistband (or even a tad higher), it would really emphasize their height and give them even more of a vintage look.

Kind regards,
Indy

 

[dakotanorth]

Suit sizing troubles?

I mean no offense to magnoli. I don't know him and have never seen his work. He has always seemed like a good guy, so I am glad to hear he is willing to work with you.

But my question is a general one about custom work. HOw hard can it be. You are a fairly normal physique. How hard can it be to take a vintage pair of pants, and rip them apart to get a good custom pattern and do duplicates of them. I don't even think that should be necessery, but if that is what it takes, why not do it?

I just don't really get why these custom guys have trouble giving us what we want.

I am guessing the problem is generally with a tailor not beliving us when we say what we want, or not being willing to change. I would think Indy would not have this problem.

Does he do the tailoring, or does he have tailors in Australia or Asia maybe do it. I ma guessing it is the latter ,in which case he might be having the same problem as we have with tailors. We tell them what we want and they give us what they want.

Hope this can get worked out for you and Indy can continue to build his business by giving the people what they want.

Let me ask you this: How is that I've worn the same size of pants for several years now, yet I continually have to alter them? Waist in, waist out, seat out, cuffs down, cuffs up, etc?
Altering pants alone involves a difference of +/-1 inch. That's it!! Two guys may have the same measurements, yet one fits completely different into his pants than another. Sway backs, protruding stomach, high hip bones, etc.
All of these things play into the fit of a garment. I've even noticed that my pants are about 1 inch larger on the left than the right- I'm left-handed ya know....
It is true that the loose cut "baggy" pants of the mid-century are easier to size b/c they basically drape from the waist down, but still, there's more than the waist circumference involved.

Ok, with THAT being said... I hate to be evil, but I looked at the suits offered through Magnoli and I have to say, I was not impressed. I think more than anything it is the fabric and the photos more than the suit itself. Or am I wrong? The photos make the suits just look.... cheap.

 

[Indy Magnoli]

Here is a digital mock-up to illustrate what I mean:

Kind regards,
Indy

 

[CharlestonBows]

As for internet tailoring, the fit is only as good as the measurements provided. I do my best to go through and make sure there are no glaring inconsistencies, but that really only catches major mistakes. Having a tailor measure you can save a lot of hardache indeed.

...

Sometimes there is a bit of trial-and-error with ordering on-line, but most of my customers get just what they are after on the first go.

The custom thing is hard enough, but to do it over the internet is nigh impossible. So props to Indy on being as successful as he is. I've not touch any of the man's work, nor have I done business with him. However, I do know a little something about tailoring.

Unless the tailor/cutter/clothier can put his tape on you, see the nuances of your body, your shape, and talk with you at length about what it is that you want, one has to make some allowances. If you're looking to have details met, and things done absolutely perfectly, I don't think you're gonna get it online. Outside of generic patterns, etc. it just doesn't work that way.

I hate to see so much frustration, and I know that it can be very trying indeed -- if he's anything like the rest of us, it is as much stress for Indy as it is for his customers, I'm sure.

I just don't really get why these custom guys have trouble giving us what we want.

Custom is hard. True custom, that is.

Nowadays every other rag salesman you see offers some form of 'custom'. What it amounts to is give your jacket size, give your waist size, and they order a pre-patterned garment and tailor it to fit. It's glorified off-the-peg; not custom.

My store offers true custom. It can't be done over the phone, and it can't be done online. Other people's measurements are not usually accepted. This is for the reason illustrated in this thread -- just too much room for error, and errors cost money. Tailors, by their nature, are a bit of a control freak. I put my tape on to your body, and I take about 25 measurements, sometimes more. All told, I spend an average of 45 minutes to an hour with each client discussing modeling, fabrics, the whole shebang. After the client leaves, the real work begins. I spend about an extra hour to two hours going through the measurements, plugging them into the models they ordered, making adjustment after adjustment, based on my personal impressions and observations during the fitting. All told, before the order is even sent to be cut, a total of about 3 hours is spent. After the garment is cut, which takes about 7 days, I sometimes, but not always, opt for a second fitting before finishing and delivery. I usually turn a suit around in about 10 to 12 days, depending on fabric. It's one of the most stressful, but fun, parts of my job.

So to answer the question -- making a generic, ready-made pant from a pattern, whether that pattern is based on vintage trousers or not, is fairly simple. Making a truly custom pair of trousers, to individual specifications, is a little more difficult. Through the medium of the internet, it's actually pretty amazing that it can be done with any really consistency.

In short -- it's pretty tough! lol

 

[CharlestonBows]

I've been told the thing to do is get a professional tailor to do the measurements, and tip him $20 or $30.

I wish I would get a tip like that for measurements! I usually get a hand shake, a business card, and at best, a buck or two! lol

 

[Not-Bogart13]

I think it should be an excepted reality that mail order and custom/made-to-measure can only combine so successfully. That said... I have a shirt and pants from Magnoli that have spoiled me in terms of fit and comfort. As it happens, I have unusual measurements, and it's hard for me to really find a good fit off the rack. So odd are my numbers that Mags keeps asking me to double check every time I send a new measurement! lol
It really is the best that can be done under the circumstances, and Indy goes a long way to get things right.

I have high hopes that my suit (now on order) will come out as well as my pants and shirt did last year, but I'm braced for possible issues with the jacket and vest, which are my first from him. However, I know he'll back what he sells, so I'm not that worried.