Kreosote Boots

[Zoro]

lol not to knock down your idea, it’s a good one for an orderly operation. But in the case of this maker and their claimed build time of 4-5 years, I’d rather watch grass grow than monitor that spreadsheet for my order.

I was throwing it in general, not for this specific maker. I do think it would help for this person, as I think at this stage it's fair to ask "is he even making them?", but the main one would be (or would had been) to simply limit the amount of orders done at a certain time, as said before.

 

[navetsea]

there must be a forum for cobblers and shoemakers somewhere, if he has big orders a single person can't manage like special collaboration order from influencer while he has his hands full with fully paid orders, he can ask fellow cobblers in the area to help him to subcontract with the sole work, I think working on the sole are not too special compared to the special last and upper works

 

[Aloysius]

there must be a forum for cobblers and shoemakers somewhere, if he has big orders a single person can't manage like special collaboration order from influencer while he has his hands full with fully paid orders, he can ask fellow cobblers in the area to help him to subcontract with the sole work, I think working on the sole are not too special compared to the special last and upper works

He doesn't even make the customers a last apparently.

But no he won't even have his own apprentices let alone work with a peer. He thinks it shows his authenticity.

 

[dannyk]

He doesn't even make the customers a last apparently.

But no he won't even have his own apprentices let alone work with a peer. He thinks it shows his authenticity.

I have an uncle who makes handmade moccasins. They are not super complicated Mocs very traditional native style. Super high quality and premium materials but he was the same way. I have a friend who’s super big into and worked for tons of places in my hometown doing high level marketing. I have my connections on places like here and other boot, jacket and denim places that would be interested. We volunteered to work for him at first for free just to get him fully going. And to learn the trade and take over one day. But he stayed super small scale making sales on his Etsy with no retirement plan and now he’s in his 60s and getting arthritis and can’t make as many or work with certain materials anymore. But he was similar to Gabbard. Just everything is made by hand by me. It was all his marketing was essentially. By hand by me. One maker. To a degree I get it. But you’ll never grow and never have a real career or make a real mark or hell retire comfortably if you’re not willing to learn, grow, accept help, or train the next generation.

 

[Aloysius]

I have an uncle who makes handmade moccasins. They are not super complicated Mocs very traditional native style. Super high quality and premium materials but he was the same way. I have a friend who’s super big into and worked for tons of places in my hometown doing high level marketing. I have my connections on places like here and other boot, jacket and denim places that would be interested. We volunteered to work for him at first for free just to get him fully going. And to learn the trade and take over one day. But he stayed super small scale making sales on his Etsy with no retirement plan and now he’s in his 60s and getting arthritis and can’t make as many or work with certain materials anymore. But he was similar to Gabbard. Just everything is made by hand by me. It was all his marketing was essentially. By hand by me. One maker. To a degree I get it. But you’ll never grow and never have a real career or make a real mark or hell retire comfortably if you’re not willing to learn, grow, accept help, or train the next generation.

I think for me the most fundamental issue here is that the reason many of us are into the whole "craft" thing is that we believe we're reviving a tradition or craft of whatever. Especially with the younger guys entering crafts.

But if the person is adamant on not having apprentices and so on, then that isn't happening. At least your uncle is an older generation; if you're a younger guy now getting into something like this, clearly something drew you. You're not serving your knowledge if you don't pass it on.

And indeed the apprentice system does a lot for quality control!

 

[dannyk]

I think for me the most fundamental issue here is that the reason many of us are into the whole "craft" thing is that we believe we're reviving a tradition or craft of whatever. Especially with the younger guys entering crafts.

But if the person is adamant on not having apprentices and so on, then that isn't happening. At least your uncle is an older generation; if you're a younger guy now getting into something like this, clearly something drew you. You're not serving your knowledge if you don't pass it on.

And indeed the apprentice system does a lot for quality control!

I have a lot of friends in the skilled trades. The apprentice/journeyman system creates the best, longest lasting and most skilled tradesman. Every now and then yeah you’ll find some self taught brilliant builder/maker and every now and then some natural savant comes along. But my buddies swear by the apprentice/journeymen system. Some complain they want to advance faster or take all the trainings at once, get more pay. But they never last. They make more mistakes. They drop out. They change careers. The ones that stick with it, learn from those wiser and more skilled and take advantage of all the trainings and courses on offer are the ones who make a real career out of it. Who move up the chain. Who becomes masters, owners of their own shop, and have the big houses and can afford the family vacation.

 

[Aloysius]

I have a lot of friends in the skilled trades. The apprentice/journeyman system creates the best, longest lasting and most skilled tradesman. Every now and then yeah you’ll find some self taught brilliant builder/maker and every now and then some natural savant comes along. But my buddies swear by the apprentice/journeymen system. Some complain they want to advance faster or take all the trainings at once, get more pay. But they never last. They make more mistakes. They drop out. They change careers. The ones that stick with it, learn from those wiser and more skilled and take advantage of all the trainings and courses on offer are the ones who make a real career out of it. Who move up the chain. Who becomes masters, owners of their own shop, and have the big houses and can afford the family vacation.

My complaint is more that Gabbard actively boasts about not having apprentices, like that shows his quality.

 

[dannyk]

My complaint is more that Gabbard actively boasts about not having apprentices, like that shows his quality.

Yeah I totally get that. I just added that to show it works! Like hey man it works! Nothing to fear. Nothing bad to say about it. The system works. Just use it. Plus if you’re as good as you say and truly appreciate the craft and history pass it down!

 

[Aloysius]

Yeah I totally get that. I just added that to show it works! Like hey man it works! Nothing to fear. Nothing bad to say about it. The system works. Just use it. Plus if you’re as good as you say and truly appreciate the craft and history pass it down!

I recently became a customer at a place run by two real masters of the craft and was having trouble deciding between which of them I wanted to make my jacket, but it turned out one had retired. I was bummed for a moment then realized it's kind of the best of both worlds, because the one who's still there trained with the other (as well as decades of working at other firms) so really I am benefiting from both their experience either way.

 

[dannyk]

I recently became a customer at a place run by two real masters of the craft and was having trouble deciding between which of them I wanted to make my jacket, but it turned out one had retired. I was bummed for a moment then realized it's kind of the best of both worlds, because the one who's still there trained with the other (as well as decades of working at other firms) so really I am benefiting from both their experience either way.

I am from Buffalo New York, the owner of Parkhurst boots is from Buffalo. He was family friends with and then worked for a master cobbler here in Buffalo. I got to know Andrew the owner at a pop up he did here super early in his career. He even took me to meet the cobbler he trained with and inspired him. That’s what’s lost when you refuse to teach and pass on knowledge. That crusty old cobbler changed Andrew’s life and now his inspiration started a flourishing business which is also provided more good jobs and someday someone may buy a Parkhurst boot and be inspired to keep it going. Or Andrew will teach his family or some young punk like himself will come along and they will make the next best boots. Or become buffalos next master cobbler.

 

[Aloysius]

I am from Buffalo New York, the owner of Parkhurst boots is from Buffalo. He was family friends with and then worked for a master cobbler here in Buffalo. I got to know Andrew the owner at a pop up he did here super early in his career. He even took me to meet the cobbler he trained with and inspired him. That’s what’s lost when you refuse to teach and pass on knowledge. That crusty old cobbler changed Andrew’s life and now his inspiration started a flourishing business which is also provided more good jobs and someday someone may buy a Parkhurst boot and be inspired to keep it going. Or Andrew will teach his family or some young punk like himself will come along and they will make the next best boots. Or become buffalos next master cobbler.

It's funny but I remember seeing a post from you years ago about the company and I didn't remember the name so I kept searching TFL with your username and boots in vain.

 

[dannyk]

It's funny but I remember seeing a post from you years ago about the company and I didn't remember the name so I kept searching TFL with your username and boots in vain.

That’s funny. Yeah I was one of his first customers and one of if not the first person to post about his boots on TFL I think. That was so long ago now. But see it made an impact. Gotta pass the knowledge and love along.

If you’re an 8.5D I am selling a pair of Parkhurst Richmond’s in Gaucho Moose. Unworn. For 150 could maybe do more off retail. Amazing boots I just have too many and am trying to narrow it down to like my 3-4 favorites and actually focus on wearing them.

 

[El Marro]

I have an uncle who makes handmade moccasins. They are not super complicated Mocs very traditional native style. Super high quality and premium materials but he was the same way. I have a friend who’s super big into and worked for tons of places in my hometown doing high level marketing. I have my connections on places like here and other boot, jacket and denim places that would be interested. We volunteered to work for him at first for free just to get him fully going. And to learn the trade and take over one day. But he stayed super small scale making sales on his Etsy with no retirement plan and now he’s in his 60s and getting arthritis and can’t make as many or work with certain materials anymore. But he was similar to Gabbard. Just everything is made by hand by me. It was all his marketing was essentially. By hand by me. One maker. To a degree I get it. But you’ll never grow and never have a real career or make a real mark or hell retire comfortably if you’re not willing to learn, grow, accept help, or train the next generation.

I love your uncle’s moccasins, I am still wearing the first pair I bought five years ago, I put them on every night when I get home from work.

 

[Tom71]

I have an uncle who makes handmade moccasins. They are not super complicated Mocs very traditional native style. Super high quality and premium materials but he was the same way. I have a friend who’s super big into and worked for tons of places in my hometown doing high level marketing. I have my connections on places like here and other boot, jacket and denim places that would be interested. We volunteered to work for him at first for free just to get him fully going. And to learn the trade and take over one day. But he stayed super small scale making sales on his Etsy with no retirement plan and now he’s in his 60s and getting arthritis and can’t make as many or work with certain materials anymore. But he was similar to Gabbard. Just everything is made by hand by me. It was all his marketing was essentially. By hand by me. One maker. To a degree I get it. But you’ll never grow and never have a real career or make a real mark or hell retire comfortably if you’re not willing to learn, grow, accept help, or train the next generation.

Nothing wrong with that, beautiful even. A way a lot of “real traditional crafts” work. The knowledge is spread by other people watching for years, being handed over minuscule parts of the process. All tiny steps over a long time. Think Italian nonna rolling her strozzapreti on a little table in front of her doorstep. The real deal, but not a business by any means.
It is only a problem if you make one out of it. The internet, hype and all of the world jumping on one product that was always meant to be a family affair are simply not a good fit for something that’s works one item per week only.

 

[dannyk]

Nothing wrong with that, beautiful even. A way a lot of “real traditional crafts” work. The knowledge is spread by other people watching for years, being handed over minuscule parts of the process. All tiny steps over a long time. Think Italian nonna rolling her strozzapreti on a little table in front of her doorstep. The real deal, but not a business by any means.
It is only a problem if you make one out of it. The internet, hype and all of the world jumping on one product that was always meant to be a family affair are simply not a good fit for something that’s works one item per week only.

No I don’t think there’s anything wrong with it at all. If that’s what works. Trust me I wasn’t saying my friend and I had huge plans and he screwed us over or something. Or we are some big shots who wanted to hostile take over his small little business or something haha. Without getting into family drama let’s just say he hasn’t had stable work in decades. Has no life savings, no retirement, no health insurance, has borrowed money from a lot of people, has moved in and out of my grandmas house a 100 times. Now he’s like 65 and getting arthritis but has no health insurance and a few hundred dollars in his bank account.

So my point was we were willing to try and help him turn his lifelong craft and something he was really good at and enjoyed doing and tried making a career, and really help him make it exactly that. But he refused. He wouldn’t budge. We were trying to legitimately help him. And yeah one day many years down the line continue on the tradition. But yeah that didn’t happen, and I don’t know how to make the moccasins he didn’t teach us anything, nor let us ever help. So his process dies with him whenever that is.

All that to say no nothing wrong with keeping it small, just a hobby, in the family, his little side project. Or teaching and learning over many years. But just so you know none of that happened and he’s out of luck and time haha.

 

[Tom71]

No I don’t think there’s anything wrong with it at all. If that’s what works. Trust me I wasn’t saying my friend and I had huge plans and he screwed us over or something. Or we are some big shots who wanted to hostile take over his small little business or something haha. Without getting into family drama let’s just say he hasn’t had stable work in decades. Has no life savings, no retirement, no health insurance, has borrowed money from a lot of people, has moved in and out of my grandmas house a 100 times. Now he’s like 65 and getting arthritis but has no health insurance and a few hundred dollars in his bank account.

So my point was we were willing to try and help him turn his lifelong craft and something he was really good at and enjoyed doing and tried making a career, and really help him make it exactly that. But he refused. He wouldn’t budge. We were trying to legitimately help him. And yeah one day many years down the line continue on the tradition. But yeah that didn’t happen, and I don’t know how to make the moccasins he didn’t teach us anything, nor let us ever help. So his process dies with him whenever that is.

All that to say no nothing wrong with keeping it small, just a hobby, in the family, his little side project. Or teaching and learning over many years. But just so you know none of that happened and he’s out of luck and time haha.

Absolutely! I think it was a good thing you tried to help. At the same time I do get the desire to keep thing as they are. As futile as such desire may appear.

 

[dannyk]

I love your uncle’s moccasins, I am still wearing the first pair I bought five years ago, I put them on every night when I get home from work.

They really are super comfortable and versatile. I’m just sad. All of mine got the rubber bottoms because I love wearing them outside and 3 of my pairs have blown a tire so to speak. Aka the rubber has finally worn down and needs a resole. That’s one of the things he’s stopped doing since his hands are not as strong anymore due to onset of arthritis. The concoction of rubber cement and tire tread is too thick and the sanding down of the leather too much. So he doesn’t do that anymore. As he’s my uncle he may be willing to do a quick patch job just for me. I also assume that part can’t be too hard. I know how to sand, I would just need to ask how much rubber cement and where he buys the tire re-tread from. I can mix that and spread it out. The cutting and stitching is the skilled part I would lack the knowledge on. But I may also just turn them into house shoes/slippers now.

I have two regrets 1. That I wasn’t able to get him onboard with my plan with my friend. Not only for myself as I obviously have a passion for the craft and history. I would love to be involved for a living. But also to help him out as he’s had a crazy insane, interesting but ultimately unfulfilling life. And 2, more people here didn’t grab a pair when he was using all sorts of leathers and styles. I think folks here would have loved them.

 

[red devil]

They really are super comfortable and versatile. I’m just sad. All of mine got the rubber bottoms because I love wearing them outside and 3 of my pairs have blown a tire so to speak. Aka the rubber has finally worn down and needs a resole. That’s one of the things he’s stopped doing since his hands are not as strong anymore due to onset of arthritis. The concoction of rubber cement and tire tread is too thick and the sanding down of the leather too much. So he doesn’t do that anymore. As he’s my uncle he may be willing to do a quick patch job just for me. I also assume that part can’t be too hard. I know how to sand, I would just need to ask how much rubber cement and where he buys the tire re-tread from. I can mix that and spread it out. The cutting and stitching is the skilled part I would lack the knowledge on. But I may also just turn them into house shoes/slippers now.

I have two regrets 1. That I wasn’t able to get him onboard with my plan with my friend. Not only for myself as I obviously have a passion for the craft and history. I would love to be involved for a living. But also to help him out as he’s had a crazy insane, interesting but ultimately unfulfilling life. And 2, more people here didn’t grab a pair when he was using all sorts of leathers and styles. I think folks here would have loved them.

I should have grabbed a moose pair...

 

[Edward]

I say keep it simple:
View attachment 675178

Ugg boots always amuse me. Back in the eighties - long before I'd heard the name 'Ugg' (I think maybe when it was still a generic Australian term that hadn't travelled, rather than a brand), my grandmother got a pair for Christmas, to wear as house slippers and keep her ankles warm in the cold - helped with her arthritis. The little ankle-length ones like Ronnie Wood wears. Twenty odd years later, they were being worn by all the fashionable undergraduate girls, and all I could see were them all wearing old lay arthritis slippers.

All I'm saying is Julian Imrie of Julian Boots has actual pedigree we can check and has been making good on his deliveries of boots for over a decade lol.

I saw some of his boots on eBay. Way beyond my budget, but lovely stuff.