Knives and forks

[dhermann1]

I made a comment about this posting under the Most Important Meal of the Day thread:

In honor of this thread, I had my favorite breakfast this morning. (And partially because the thread made me hungry too.)
My breakfast, for your viewing pleasure:

in which I criticised (politely) the arrangement of the knife. It occurred to me that I remember how my grandmother always told me fork on the left, knife on the right with the blade pointing inward, and spoon on the right of the knife. But that's just the bare bones flat ware arrangement. Who can really fill us in on proper arrangement for knives and forks? I recall also being told that you arrange them so you work your way from the outside in, so that after you use a utensile, you still leave a complete looking set for the next course. Is it necessary to have a PhD in cutlery to get it right?
(Whoa! It my 999th posting! I've reached a tenth of a Chevalier! Drum roll please! Me and A-Rod, waiting for our next major milestone! Took him 9 years, me only 6 months. I wonder what I'll do for my big 1-0-0-0.)

 

[LizzieMaine]

From my high school home-ec book, which I just happen to have on the shelf here ("Adventures In Homemaking" is the title.) --

"The silver for each cover is placed one inch from the edge of the table. The knife is placed at the right of the plate with the right edge turned toward the plate. The spoon is placed at the right of the knife with the bowl turned up. The fork is placed as the left of the plate with the tines up. When no knife is used the fork is placed at the right of the plate. The oyster cocktail fork is placed at the right of the spoons or on the plate which is under the cocktail glass."

There it is -- now watch those measurements, kids, Mrs. Dunton will be coming around the class with her ruler, and if you're off by more than an eighth of an inch, you'll be sorry.

 

[scotrace]

Is it necessary to have a PhD in cutlery to get it right?

Yes.

Do you want to know proper setting for breakfast, luncheon or dinner?

 

[Smithy]

There are differences as well between British table settings and those on the Continent. NZ and Australia use British settings and also the British way of using cutlery.

Not too sure about how you Americans do it, although I noticed when I was in the States that the method of holding cutlery and using it seemed different to the British manner.

 

[dhermann1]

Yes, we switch the fork from left to right hand after cutting the meat. The Brits pile the food onto the back of the fork and leave it in the left hand. What a shock it was the first time I saw that. Of course the cerebellum gets programmed early on, so learning a different way as an adult would be a sure formula for food all over the floor. I think the Americans came up with this innovation some time in the 19th century. I recall being told that it was to show that you didn't have a weapon in your right hand.
OK, so we have the basics of kniffs, ferks and sponns, but what about the fancy schmancy 11 course dinners with the fish forks and the dessert forks, etc., etc?
(OMG, I just hit a grand! That means I'm officially One Too Many. Whoopeedoo.)

 

[BJBAmerica]

Found this on the web....Might come in handy:

http://www.fordham.edu/images/facilities/food/pdfs/etiquette2.pdf

 

[scotrace]

Emily Post was adamant that the American Method of "zig-zag" eating (putting down the knife, transferring fork to right hand after each morsel cutting) was foolishness. She strongly urged adoption of the method seen in GB and elsewhere - keep fork in left hand, knife in right (reverse for lefties).

 

[Smithy]

keep fork in left hand, knife in right (reverse for lefties).

Actually in the British manner if you are left handed you still keep the fork in the left hand and the knife in the right. The fork in the right hand is considered bad manners traditionally. Also "pen and inking" (hold the knife as you would a pen), and using your fork as a shovel are not the done thing traditionally either.

 

[BeBopBaby]

I'm American yet I've always eaten and held my fork and knife in the British fashion. Being right-handed, I think I've always preferred cutting food with my right hand. It's just much more comfortable for me that way. I never really thought about it much before, I wonder if fellow U.S. citizens think I am performing a faux pas? At any rate, I blame my British grandfather for the habit.

 

[Baron Kurtz]

Absurdity.

Has it come to this?

bk

 

[Senator Jack]

Absurdity.

Has it come to this?

bk

Should we expect anything less than this from a long-haired pinko?

 

[LizzieMaine]

Continuing from "Adventures In Homemaking" --

"When there are several kinds of silver, they are arranged in the order in which they are to be used, beginning at the outside of the cover and working toward the plate. This does not mean that spoons and knives are intermingled. The spoons are placed at the extreme right in the order in which they are to be used, and the knives are placed between the spoons and the plate, in the order in which they are to be used. To illustrate, if a soup spoon is to be used before a teaspoon, the soupspoon should be placed to the right of the teaspoon. If the salad is to be served as a separate course following the main course, the dinner fork should be placed at the left and the salad fork should be placed at the right of the dinner fork and next to the plate."

Simplicity itself. I can't understand why I only got a B in that course.

 

[Baron Kurtz]

Should we expect anything less than this from a long-haired pinko?

How dare you! I'm red to the core. No pink here.

bk

 

[Senator Jack]

How long before we get thrown out?

 

[scotrace]

Yes, correction. I added the reverse for lefties bit for PC sake it is isn't correct after all!

 

[scotrace]

Not to worry, BK. These rules only apply if one eats with utensils.

 

[Shaul-Ike Cohen]

Typical strange manners I learned (about) as a child were that some people crush peas onto the back of the fork (I never did that), and in America, you have your left hand on your knee most of the time, and only show it to take over the fork when you cut something with your right.

 

[Senator Jack]

I done thought you should always eat them peas with a knife.

 

[Shaul-Ike Cohen]

How dare you! I'm red to the core. No pink here.

Ah, time for a new user name? But it might be misleading.

 

[Marc Chevalier]

How long before we get thrown out?

Jack, Jack ... we're not leaving the Fedora Lounge. On the contrary: the Fedora Lounge is leaving us. But that's a subject for an unborn thread ...

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