Hey WildRoot!

[BellyTank]

What about this one?
Which period is this one from?

BT.

 

[Matt Deckard]

Looks modern to me.

 

[BellyTank]

Mr. Deckard?

OK- what is it that makes it look modern to you, as opposed to a fashionable European jacket from 50+ years ago?

BT.

 

[Matt Deckard]

The sleaves.

 

[BellyTank]

Can you not be a little more descriptive or specific?
If you're talking about the sleeve head/armhole, they're actually quite high/close but the angle is showing through to the back of the sleeves.
The shoulders are actually quite stiff and padded not so wide. The later, '40s styles had the wider shoulders- modern shoulders would look different to this.
This classic style has remained quite true in more modern English Classic Country/Sportswear. This is actually a European one, not American, in case you didn't already guess.
What do you say?

BT.

 

[Matt Deckard]

Very european, and modern European to my eye specifically because the sleaves bell out. Modern European jackets do have higher cut armholes and their sleaves are made to cover the hand a bit more than Amercan made jackets.

Then again I could be wrong.

Lets see what Root says.

 

[BellyTank]

Sleeves-

Nope, the sleeves are straight, it's just the picture and the way they're hanging and the perspective- the transition from the sleeve at the head, where it's 'open' to where it's turned and lying almost flat at the cuff. Just the way it's hanging-

BT.

 

[BellyTank]

P.S...

...what about lapel breadth/notch height and it's bearing on vintage style?
BT.

 

[Matt Deckard]

Lapels for high roll three button suits are narrow nowadays in the US and on many suits I see from britain, though the high end Brit shops are still going with that wider lapel with a curved edge.

They had some pretty curved lapels in the 30's, mainly on the 2 button suits. The one pictured looks modern to me.

 

[Wild Root]

Well boys, to me it doesn't shout 20's, 30's or 40's. It has a very modern English cut with the high cut lapels I'm all most sure it's not a vintage suit coat. I don't know the English style very well as Matt does and well, I don't really care for it my self. When it comes to vintage, I love the American styles of the time. I see it has high arm holes and that's a good thing. But, it would be safe to say that coat was made with in the last 10 years.

Hope that helps ya BT.

 

[BellyTank]

What about this...

-The left jacket on the right page- look at the styling- my example has the slim, streamlined waisted look, the bowed lapels, the radiused bottoms.
What's the perceived difference? Are you assuming or instinctually erring conservatively, cautiously on the opinion that it's not 'vintage'?...just a feeling? Take away the spread collar and modern tie... It's a modern 'looking' suit inasmuch as it's a timeless style and doesn't look out of place in a modern setting.
But what's not 'vintage' about it?

BT.

 

[Matt Deckard]

The cut of the jacket just looks modern, to me it is very unlike the early 20th century illustrations shown. Be it the shoulders or the cut of the sleeves or the body shape or the lapels, I think it is modern.

What is the back story on the jacket?

 

[BellyTank]

I can't see how it's really unlike the illustration- considering that the illustration is actually exaggerating the sleekness and slimness of the style and a real jacket wouldn't look exactly like the drawing. The proportions are next to identical.
The back story? You mean what the back of the jacket looks like?
Well, if I were to tell you that it was plain, you might think differently than if I told you it was belted, pleated and gussetted.

Anyhow, it's not that old, it's an early '50s English suit jacket but the style is close to the example in the 1918 catalogue. I was just reflecting on the fashion cycles.

BT.

 

[Matt Deckard]

By back story I meant history. I can't think of that being belted unless it made from the 70's to now.


This is the 20's
Very very fitted in the shoulders and around the body with a narrow lapel. Also notice the amount of open space between the lapels creating a tight accute "V".

 

[Wild Root]

Hey Matt, that photo is sweet!

So the coat is from the early 50's. Post war English suits pretty much had a classic look about them. They were all very plane and basic in cut and style.
Even in the early 60's they sort of reverted back to the 20's style with just lower waisted pants.

Ok, I was wrong about it being a 10 year old jacket, but I knew that it wasn't a coat from the early 20's. I have seen the real deal and they just show age, wear and details that a copy or later item lacks. I'm going to be taking some photos today and I'll post a photo of a jacket in my collection dated 1923 so you may see for your self.

Root.

 

[BellyTank]

No- I never claimed it was from the '20s, that would have just been silly-
I only ever hinted that it could be 50+ yrs. old.
I know my fashion eras too.
The catalogue illustration was just to portray the similarities and the nuance- some people can't see it.
Sure it's easier to observe when the item is being worn.
Funny how things go round, huh?

BT.

 

[Matt Deckard]

Styles do repeat though details change.

 

[Wild Root]

BT, I didn’t want to imply that you didn’t know your stuff. If I did, I’m sorry man. Here is a photo of my 1923 suit coat. I have the matching vest with this but to bad the pants didn’t survive to stick around with the rest of the outfit.

Enjoy.

Root.

 

[BellyTank]

That's a really nice example 'Root.
I didn't think you were questioning me at all- not at all.
That example I gave is of a style that has somehow managed to stay in the 'English Catalogue' since the '30s and become a staple of the 'Country Set'
As a wise Lady once said; "The British way of progress isn’t to look the future coldly in the eye but to constantly move forward by looking back."
We all have our reputations to maintain...
We each and all have our areas of interest, experience and expertise and where they overlap lies the mutual pleasure and discovery.

And I for one, am enjoying myself here-
-Thank you

BT.