German & Austrian Hutmachers

[steur]

Part II
The way the bow is done with the visible stitch at the top and no stitching at all at the bottom makes me think it is an earlier one. Late thirties maybe?
It needs more cleaning and steaming, but there's a neat hat in there somewhere (certainly for the price).

The liner I took out.

The retailer's imprint (too faded to decipher).

The Hückel Standard emblem on the sweatband is slightly more visible.

As far as I can make out it could be something like:
derBIRRHENhut or derHIRRHENhut

 

[mayserwegener]

Here's an interesting find. Listed as an Echter Borsalino size 52 and bought for 1 euro. The shipping costs were twenty times that. It arrived in a box just big enough for the postage stamp and out popped this one.
Not a Borsalino, but a Hückel Standard in a size 55. An honest mistake by the seller though, because the Borsalino liner is real enough. The cardboard behind the sweatband made the hat seem smaller than it is. The liner is a later addition of course, as the hat was originally unlined. I took out the liner and found that the Hückel crown patch was gone, but the patch from the dealer was still there. Can't really make heads or tails of it though. It looks like the same design is on the sweatband as well, but even more faded. It didn't need all that much persuasion to return to somewhat normal, but more TLC is needed.
Bound brim at 5cm and crown 11cm at the center dent (more or less).
The way it was listed:
View attachment 235310 View attachment 235311 View attachment 235312

What it is at this moment:
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More in part II

Stefan, Very interesting! Looking forward to Part 2!

 

[steur]

Stefan, Very interesting! Looking forward to Part 2!

Thanks, Steve. Hope you can maybe shed some light on this one.

 

[Mean Eyed Matt]

Stefan, what a great deal! Congrats!
I'm pretty sure the retailers crown patch reads: DER MARKEN HUT

 

[steur]

Stefan, what a great deal! Congrats!
I'm pretty sure the retailors crown patch reads: DER MARKEN HUT

Excellent! Thanks; I could have wrecked my brain trying to figure this out!

 

[Mean Eyed Matt]

You're welcome!
However, I think this "extraordinary" company name will not help you for the origin.

 

[mayserwegener]

Part II
The way the bow is done with the visible stitch at the top and no stitching at all at the bottom makes me think it is an earlier one. Late thirties maybe?
It needs more cleaning and steaming, but there's a neat hat in there somewhere (certainly for the price).
View attachment 235318
The liner I took out.
View attachment 235319
View attachment 235320
The retailer's imprint (too faded to decipher).
View attachment 235321 View attachment 235322
The Hückel Standard emblem on the sweatband is slightly more visible.
View attachment 235323
As far as I can make out it could be something like:
derBIRRHENhut or derHIRRHENhut
View attachment 235324

Stefan, Very interesting! Looks like the Echter Borsalino liner (definitely WWII era or earlier and stitched in) was applied a long while ago. The later added "DER MARKEN HUT" is also WWII era or older. It's definitely an original JHS "Standard" and it's rare to see one that had a Crown Patch. May I ask its weight? Also where was the seller located?

 

[Mean Eyed Matt]

I just stared at the sweatband 50 times:
With a little practice (and imagination) you can decipher the imprint also as: Der Marken Hut
So both features actually belong together - as you thought.

 

[mayserwegener]

I just stared at the sweatband 50 times:
With a little practice (and imagination) you can decipher the imprint also as: Der Marken Hut
So both features actually belong together - as you thought.

Matt, Yes I can also see it on the sweatband. The "Der Marken Hut" crown patch is interesting because it's overlapping the missing crown patch. I will have look through some of my old trade papers. The "Der Marken Hut" seems familiar.

 

[Mean Eyed Matt]

This is really very interesting with the overlapping patch.
I first thought it might be the sign of a hatter who has revised/renewed the inner parts.
But that wouldn't fit, because on the sweat band there is "Der Marken Hut"
as well as the original Hückel logo...

 

[steur]

Stefan, Very interesting! Looks like the Echter Borsalino liner (definitely WWII era or earlier and stitched in) was applied a long while ago. The later added "DER MARKEN HUT" is also WWII era or older. It's definitely an original JHS "Standard" and it's rare to see one that had a Crown Patch. May I ask its weight? Also where was the seller located?

I just stared at the sweatband 50 times:
With a little practice (and imagination) you can decipher the imprint also as: Der Marken Hut
So both features actually belong together - as you thought.

Matt, Yes I can also see it on the sweatband. The "Der Marken Hut" crown patch is interesting because it's overlapping the missing crown patch. I will have look through some of my old trade papers. The "Der Marken Hut" seems familiar.

This is really very interesting with the overlapping patch.
I first thought it might be the sign of a hatter who has revised/renewed the inner parts.
But that wouldn't fit, because on the sweat band there is "Der Marken Hut"
as well as the original Hückel logo...

Gentlemen, thank you. It seems to be a bit of a puzzler with the various bits and pieces. The hat is fairly lightweight at only 108 grams and the seller was located in München.

 

[mayserwegener]

Gentlemen, thank you. It seems to be a bit of a puzzler with the various bits and pieces. The hat is fairly lightweight at only 108 grams and the seller was located in München.

Stefan, Thank you for checking the weight. I think you are correct on the dating. Are the Ribbon/Bow stitches hidden by the sweatband?

 

[mayserwegener]

Here is a video on Hat Maker Josef Kollmann from Metnitz, Austria. It's in German but it shows some interesting machines and other info. I am interested in the 1930s copies of Österreichische Hut Zeitung. Looks like he is mostly making Wool Trachten Hats. I was made aware of this video (only available for 7 days) by Wolfgang that posts here every so often.

https://tvthek.orf.at/profile/konkret/13887640/konkret/14051878/Der-Hutmacher/14697736

 

[steur]

Stefan, Thank you for checking the weight. I think you are correct on the dating. Are the Ribbon/Bow stitches hidden by the sweatband?

Thanks, Steve. They are. Without the liner it's neatly finished. The shape of the remaining crown patch has me thinking it may have been put in that way on purpose. Likely the Hückel patch would have been round or oval and therefore face or head shaped. The "derMARKENhut" patch is modelled like a hat. The idea of the two together would have been a head with a hat on top maybe?

Here is a video on Hat Maker Josef Kollmann from Metnitz, Austria. It's in German but it shows some interesting machines and other info. I am interested in the 1930s copies of Österreichische Hut Zeitung. Looks like he is mostly making Wool Trachten Hats. I was made aware of this video (only available for 7 days) by Wolfgang that posts here every so often.

https://tvthek.orf.at/profile/konkret/13887640/konkret/14051878/Der-Hutmacher/14697736

Very cool film. Thanks for the link. It should be possible to record it while it streams. And a stack of those newspapers would be nice! I've had no luck finding those in the Österreichische Nationalbibliothek though. From what I can gather is that they appeared for only two years (1937-1938) and were published by Hugo Fraenkel in Vienna.
There was a German publication called Allgemeine Hut-Zeiting that ran longer (1931-1939). The only thing I could find though were these references. Nothing digitized (bummer).

 

[Mean Eyed Matt]

Thanks, Steve. They are. Without the liner it's neatly finished. The shape of the remaining crown patch has me thinking it may have been put in that way on purpose. Likely the Hückel patch would have been round or oval and therefore face or head shaped. The "derMARKENhut" patch is modelled like a hat. The idea of the two together would have been a head with a hat on top maybe?

That's an interesting observation, Stefan! Now, if you say so, I see the "head with a hat on it." That would also explain the simultaneity of the two logos on the sweatband: The inside of the hat was designed that way from the beginning - without lining of course - on order of "derMARKENhut". So no subsequent revision as I thought at first (except the lining)... What a thrilling hat!

 

[Mean Eyed Matt]

Steco Echt Velour in grey. Model is called "Saale" and the colour is "grafit". Raw edge brim at 5,5cm and the crown 10cm at the center dent. Size is 55, but it fits me perfectly. Unreeded sweatband and a fabulous liner in this one (I think Steve has a similar one his website). Sweatband printing says EMA "Schutz Marke" (top) and "Gut zieht an!" (below).

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Just discovered by chance (maybe someone else has already said it!?):
The "EMA" imprint on the sweatband is from "Emil Mandel - Großhuthandlung Dresden".
You can see it on the right side of Steve's magazine.

 

[steur]

That's an interesting observation, Stefan! Now, if you say so, I see the "head with a hat on it." That would also explain the simultaneity of the two logos on the sweatband: The inside of the hat was designed that way from the beginning - without lining of course - on order of "derMARKENhut". So no subsequent revision as I thought at first (except the lining)... What a thrilling hat!

Thank you, Matt. Meanwhile it's cleaning up nicely. It is an idea that would explain it. While most of the times the Hückel emblems are in landscape orientation, they did have several that were in portrait as well.

 

[steur]

Just discovered by chance (maybe someone else has already said it!?):
The "EMA" imprint on the sweatband is from "Emil Mandel - Großhuthandlung Dresden".
You can see it on the right side of Steve's magazine.

Thanks, Matt. I don't recall anyone mentioning that yet, so a welcome addition to the information.

 

[mayserwegener]

Just discovered by chance (maybe someone else has already said it!?):
The "EMA" imprint on the sweatband is from "Emil Mandel - Großhuthandlung Dresden".
You can see it on the right side of Steve's magazine.

Matt, Great find! Here is a blow up from a larger photo.

 

[mayserwegener]

Thanks, Steve. They are. Without the liner it's neatly finished. The shape of the remaining crown patch has me thinking it may have been put in that way on purpose. Likely the Hückel patch would have been round or oval and therefore face or head shaped. The "derMARKENhut" patch is modelled like a hat. The idea of the two together would have been a head with a hat on top maybe?


Very cool film. Thanks for the link. It should be possible to record it while it streams. And a stack of those newspapers would be nice! I've had no luck finding those in the Österreichische Nationalbibliothek though. From what I can gather is that they appeared for only two years (1937-1938) and were published by Hugo Fraenkel in Vienna.
There was a German publication called Allgemeine Hut-Zeiting that ran longer (1931-1939). The only thing I could find though were these references. Nothing digitized (bummer).

Stefan, Makes sense. I will see if I can find anything that matches that mark.

I have some digitized copies of Österreichisch-ungarische Hutmacher-Zeitung (this was up to WWI), Österreichische Hutmacher Zeitung and Österreichische Hut Zeitung. The name must have changed some time after 1933. I also have digitized copies of Deutsche Hutmacher Zeitung but 1920 and later copies were protected by copyright.