Beltback fabric

[Benny Holiday]

I have a question I'd like to put to you guys.

Some years ago, a friend of mine was getting married and he wanted a special suit made up for the special day. He asked me if I'd take him to my tailor, a request I was very happy to help with. The style of suit he decided on was a SBPL suit with the half belt in back. His choice of fabric was a sharp-looking Holland & Sherry wool, black with white pinstripes.

Well, the suit looked the bomb. The tailor, Mario Valenti, had the stripes going horizontally along the belt in the back, which looked fine to my pre-Fedora Lounge eyes.

Anyway, as I've come to appreciate so much more visual info from suits posted here and all the great catalogue scans, I've noticed that beltback suits seem to have come in all manner of plain, tweed, and overplaid fabrics, but I've yet to see one in pinstripes. Why is that? Were pinstripes considered too formal or businesslike a pattern for a more sporting-designed garment?
And if there were pinstriped beltbacks, did the stripes continue vertically down across the belt, or did they break and go across horizontally, like Mario did with the suit he made?

(Yes, I know that's actually two questions . . . apologies!

 

[Guttersnipe]

I'm not really sure where chalk-stripe/pinstripe fit in the formality spectrum, but your right that belt-back were considered more "sporty," however, belt-backs were definitely made in stripes. It's probably just one of those oddities of the "vintage gods" that you've never seen one. On the suits I've seen the stripe run vertically on the belt and are often cut so that they match up with the stripes about and bellow.

 

[Baron Kurtz]

I concur. I'll post a couple pics of striped mid-1930s beltbacks later. IIRC, on both of my suits, the stripes on the belt match the direction of the stripes on the main body of the jacket. One is a rather "sporty" striped fabric (fawn with an orangey overstipe, the other is very sober and businesslike dark blue with white pinstripes.

I have noticed a wide variation in stripe matching. Some are very good, but the 1930s British one I picked up from Australia (Maybe it's actually Australian, but British tailored) is PoW checked and the mismatch is pretty bad.

bk

 

[Matt Deckard]

I've seen them come in all shapes and styles. I myself like the stripe to go vertical with the suit. If it's a heavier fabric I'd say fine with lining them up where they can be, since the weight will show the belt detail. if it's a lighter weight modern style fabric I'd say off set them a bit just to show the belt detail a little more, But I've seen them both ways on original striped belt backs. I have a friend right now that quite often wears a navy blue double breasted belt back that is striped.

 

[pistolpete]

Nice....

I saw the suit you made for Jason....it was excellent....:eusa_clap :eusa_clap :eusa_clap :eusa_clap :eusa_clap :eusa_clap :eusa_clap :eusa_clap :eusa_clap

 

[Benny Holiday]

Thanks for your information gents. Matt, your suit still knocks me out! And any pics from your esteemed collection Baron are always welcome.

 

[fluteplayer07]

Benny, how much does he charge for a suit to be made? Does he take international requests?

 

[Benny Holiday]

Unfortunately Fluteplayer, no, he doesn't do international work. The cost of his suits depends on fabric etc but generally AU$900-$1200 will get you a top-quality suit. When I say he's 67 and only continues working so he can take a two-month vacation to Italy every year, you probably think he's a little old skinny fellow with a tape measure around his neck when in fact he's a robust, muscular bloke who looks to be in his early 50s and a real character.

So if ever you're in Sydney, let me know!

 

[fluteplayer07]

I'd love to go out of country; traveling the world has always been a dream of mine. Sadly, I am limited by time and money. Can't even get over to Mont. West in 2011, let alone halfway around the world!

Thanks for the information, though!

 

[Benny Holiday]

I'm in the same boat bud! As for the info, you're very welcome, always!

 

[Baron Kurtz]

Dark blue pinstripe. This jacket is part of a 3 piece suit, made in Ohio in the late 1930s. It has the 1936 Union label.

bk

 

[Baron Kurtz]

I'm not quite sure how to describe the colour on this one, but it's very light with an orangey overstripe. Again, this is a 3-piece. And again, the stripes on the belt are the same direction as the stripes on the main body.

bk

 

[fluteplayer07]

Very nice! :eusa_clap

I bet one of Art's Sunset hats would look fantastic with the second one.

 

[Tailor Tom]

My little bit....

Just commenting on the belt.
granted they are made in both directions, but I would put the stripe horizontal too...fro 2 reasons.

1. The original reason of the idea of a belt-back was to cinch the waist. thus one must think of stress put upon the area of interest. The fabric is stronger running with the grain. So, make the belt running with the grain of the fabric.

2. Design-wise, I like to set off an area of interest, such as the belt. So I would make it so the stripe was in contrast (direction) to the fabric.

If it was a solid, or a summer coat, or hunt jacket, I would do it in a contrasting fabric. ie; a great khaki jacket with a corduroy belt !

 

[Benny Holiday]

Superlative examples of vintage beltbacks, Baron. Thanks for the wonderfully clear photographs!

 

[Baron Kurtz]

Superlative examples of vintage beltbacks, Baron. Thanks for the wonderfully clear photographs!

Thanks Benny. Yes, pity they're a bit more blurred than i'd like. All to keep the image size down.

bk

 

[Fletch]

Not so bad, really, because beltbacks tend to keep the suit size down. (Imagine that pale peachy number turning up in 44, or even 42. You could have one made for what it'd bring at auction. [huh])

 

[Baron Kurtz]

About as likely as them turning up in Australia. Why not have one made?

They were generally a young men's style, so it's not surprising they tend to be small.

bk

 

[Benny Holiday]

About as likely as them turning up in Australia. Why not have one made?

They were generally a young men's style, so it's not surprising they tend to be small.

bk

Indeed sir, the very reason I have mine made! And yet some photographs I viewed at the State Library last year taken in Sydney in the late 1930s showed that the style was quite popular here.

 

[Baron Kurtz]

yes, and the books Crooks Like Us and City of Shadows feature a number of criminals wearing similar styles in 1920s-30s Sydney. (And a very early Zoot suit! in 1923)

bk