Australian Vintage Suits

[cookie]

There is a single inside jacket pocket on the right side which features a tag reading: "Stamina Clothes, Tailored by Wilson, Crusader Cloth."

Here's a photo of the one of the very cool bakelite buttons sewn inside the waistband:

The suit orignally had three buttons on the sleeves, but one was chipped and currently each sleeve has two. The waist pockets on the DB jacket are flapped.

Benny I remember all of our school uniforms in the 60s being made of this coarse tough Stamina cloth.

The funny thing is that you could buy these 40s suits in the 80s for like AUD20-50 and I used to wear some when I was smaller and in my first vintage phase. My brother later wore one for years when DBs started to be popular again in the 80s. They were all solid bespoke Sunday suits with little wear for the age. Now you can't even find them in vintage stores. It was like they were all just rag bagged or something.

 

[Marc Chevalier]

Benny I remember all of our school uniforms in the 60s being made of this coarse tough Stamina cloth.

Do you think this is a version of (or the same thing as) the hardy "thornproof" cloth so often seen in vintage British suits?

 

[dr greg]

No it was lighter than Thornproof, (which I thought came from Ireland), but still very sweat-inducing, and consequently prickly to sit in a classroom with no air-con in summer, the trousers weren't lined either, I think it had to reach 90F before we were allowed to loosen our ties....

 

[Marc Chevalier]

Thornproof, (which I thought came from Ireland), ...

Perhaps the cloth does. I was referring to the suits I've seen in this cloth, which often seem to be British made.

 

[cookie]

No it was lighter than Thornproof, (which I thought came from Ireland), but still very sweat-inducing, and consequently prickly to sit in a classroom with no air-con in summer, the trousers weren't lined either, I think it had to reach 90F before we were allowed to loosen our ties....

If you went to a Catholic school and it hit 100+F you had to stay in class whereas the "publics" as they were referred to disparagingly were allowed to go home. Hence that teeshirt you see round the place"I survived Catholic school!"... But it was "charachter building" stuff of course!

That Irish Thornproof cloth was a staple of sportscoats at mens wear stores in the 60s and 70s. I have one from Fletcher Jones. A lighter tweed than in the Emerald Isle. Not as popular as the Harris tweed but both have died out as a fashion idea though my sons have worn them with teeshirts but the look is outdone by the scratchy wool on the neck. Hence when I had one made in the 80s I got a strip of leather around the collar.

The whole de-Anglosizing of Australian menswear is a subject in itself as the sartorial habits of Blighty were gradually rejected in favour of a more European/American style of dressing that is more climate and attitude friendly for punters.

Can anyone seriously imagine guys walking around and working in those suits that Benny Holiday has posted in the Down Under summer climate? Yet for years that's exactly what they did. Mind you in winter there was no air conditioning and heating in buildings and life was spent going to work on freezing buses and trains in winter.

The long socks and shorts (especially for public servants) was a short lived phenomenon in the late 60s/70s similar to the way in Bermuda the guys dress formally in shorts. This was an early Anglo start to the realization that you could not fight the Aussie summer and heralded the move to a more casual style of dressing in the 80s and onwards.

 

[dr greg]

Perhaps the cloth does. I was referring to the suits I've seen in this cloth, which often seem to be British made.

We could be pedantic and say it's British cloth anyway, because 'Irish' Thornproof would probably have been made in the North as I think that was where the mills were, but I could be wrong! Someone will know here, if anywhere!

 

[cookie]

We could be pedantic and say it's British cloth anyway, because 'Irish' Thornproof would probably have been made in the North as I think that was where the mills were, but I could be wrong! Someone will know here, if anywhere!

Correct Greg. All the Irish Thornproof special labels I have seen originate in Ulster.

 

[Benny Holiday]

Even when second-hand store finds were more plentiful for 30s-40s garments some 20+ years ago (though I'd never say abundant), I never came across a linen or seersucker vintage suit. Old family stories seem to attest to the same fact that men wore heavy suits all year round - just like it was mandatory to cook a roast dinner for Christmas Day even if it was 38 degrees Celsius outside.

 

[Shangas]

Even when second-hand store finds were more plentiful for 30s-40s garments some 20+ years ago (though I'd never say abundant), I never came across a linen or seersucker vintage suit. Old family stories seem to attest to the same fact that men wore heavy suits all year round - just like it was mandatory to cook a roast dinner for Christmas Day even if it was 38 degrees Celsius outside.

I could not possibly imagine wearing a three-piece suit during an Australian summer. I'd roast to death. But I agree, I've heard the same stories.

 

[Baron Kurtz]

The British administrators did the same in India, and pretty much everywhere they ended up - swaggering around in heavy wool morning suits and starched collars in the height of summer. morons.

 

[Shangas]

It really makes you wonder HOW they did it. I mean a morning suit, with that heavy tailcoat and all that other stuff, in 30-degree Indian heat? Eugh!

I mean, a lighter suit made of cotton, perhaps, maybe. But something thick and heavy, made of wool, designed for a European winter? That must be a nightmare to wear in the tropics.

 

[Cobden]

You also have to factor in that they would also, likely, be wearing long underwear (albeit lightweight, often silk, rather then wool) under the frock coats, especially in the late 19th century. A bit of common sense started to return to everday wear for the upper echelons of British Indian society from the Edwardian era onwards (though morning coats would still be worn for certain occasions, and for more senior staff court dress with a pith helmet would be worn for particular occasions such as the Delhi Durbar) when white and cream wool flannel suits enjoyed a vogue in India. By the interbellum, it became rather more sensible (linen suits, bush shirts, etc.) As to how they survived it...well, most of my research indicates they used the traditional methods of either imbibing copious amounts of alcohol, or failing miserably to survive it (White Man's Burden, White Man's Grave and all that).


Of course, the lower echelons of British Indian society were usually more sensible - Rudyard Kipling usully wore trousers and an undershirt when indoors whilst he worked for the Civil and Military Gazette, though he would put more clothes on to go outside

 

[dr greg]

Funnily enough, Mike Carlton's column in Saturday's SMH refers to the horrors of sitting around school in summer in Crusader cloth uniforms...and spare a thought for the Anzacs, I once worked as an extra on a Gallipoli movie shot on the Maroubra sandhills, and we wore WOOLLEN undershirts woollen jackets and pants because they were exact repro uniforms, and it was the middle of summer People were fainting all over the place, we needed girls in bikinis running around spraying cold water on us so we didn't lose continuity from all the 'casualties".
Just as well no-one was shooting at us....

 

[Two Types]

The British administrators did the same in India, and pretty much everywhere they ended up - swaggering around in heavy wool morning suits and starched collars in the height of summer. morons.

It's a bit of a misconception that everyone spent summer in India sweltering in woolen suits. The most popular course of action was to spend the height of summer high in the mountains, where whole swathes of British/Indian society would move en masse to avoid the heat. Up in the Himalayas, even in summer, wool was sensible wear.

 

[Cobden]

Indeed - the summer capital was Simla, in the hills, for that very reason.

Dr Greg - as a WWI re-enactor, I can say, one does get used to it

 

[LuckyKat]

Trade?

Is there anyone who owns an Australian suit interested in trading for an American Suit? I'm trying to collect suits from around the world...

 

[James71]

I would love a vintage suit, but alas australians of prior generations were significantly smaller than me....at 6'1 and 240 odd pounds the chance of a vintage store find is pretty slim for me.

 

[The Rag And Bone Man]

Here is one of my vintage Australian suits.. how on earth this was worn is beyond me, this suit is extremely heavy, it is built like a tank.

As you can see it is a three piece suit, the pants are button fly, and the jacket is single button, I am assuming it is from the early 40's I may be wrong.

Apart from staining to the lining and one moth hole on the inside fly, the suit looks very good, there is also as pictured the makers name attached, S Compagnon of Lismore.

 

[Shangas]

Something like that looks like what you'd wear in Melbourne or Hobart during the coldest of winters!

 

[Two Types]

Nice one. With the one button, peaked lapels and four button waistcoat, it reminds me of continental suits - like the German 'Nachmitte und Abend' suits that were a cross between day and evening wear.
The tailor's name appears to be French, it would be interesting to see close ups of the trousers etc so that the continental suit experts can tell us whether it was made in the French style.